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If there is nothing in international law that could prevent the Greeks from defaulting on debt to EU banks and institutions while accepting a loan from Russian banks and institutions and refusing to use said loan to pay the EU debt ...
As you say, they could do that; the only thing that is preventing it is that the Russian leadership are a gang of mafiosi godfathers who are unlikely give money they need to keep paying their secret policement to a proven deadbeat like Greece
Again, Russia does not see Greece as a deadbeat. You do...emotionally so.. there is a difference between you and Russia. Most the Russian cabinet including Putin have property in Greece. Greece houses the capital of the Orthodox religion and most Russians are still quite religious. Russia already sent paratroops to guard Tsipras when he got elected.
Your knowledge of the Greek Russia bond is ultra poor.
If they simply don't pay the creditors, they have around 65 billion left which will last till the end of the year..
Greece has around Euro 5.6 billion in foreign currency reserves. This could be gone in 3 months with their current trade deficit (Euro 1.7-1.8 billion).
I suspect you are confusing the Euro 68 billion credit line for Greek banks. If the Greeks really had 65 billion lying around, they could pay off a quarter of their national debt.
Greece has around Euro 5.6 billion in foreign currency reserves. This could be gone in 3 months with their current trade deficit (Euro 1.7-1.8 billion).
I suspect you are confusing the Euro 68 billion credit line for Greek banks. If the Greeks really had 65 billion lying around, they could pay off a quarter of their national debt.
Greece has to pay back 22 billion this year to its creditors. 6-7 billion of this is pure interest.
Do Syriza really hold their own people in such contempt that they are willing to align themselves with Vladimir Putin's Russia?
The Greeks themselves admire Putin. Both Greeks of the right and left. They are fond of Russia. Always have been. If Greeks have to choose between a master - Germany or Russia, most would pick Russia any day of the week.
Putin likes to visit Mount Athos, has a villa in Greece and the two countries sign pacts for fun. Greeks do not feel vomit in their mouths like many UK liberals do at the mention of Putin.
If I am honest I am quite surprised that they rejected the offer. Although the about face of the Greeks in the negotiations did seem too good to be true. Indeed the EU ministers had a strong hand but the Greeks out of nowhere back peddled and made some strange positive noises compared to their bullish attitude on Monday and Tuesday.
Something must have appeared really fishy for the Germans to reject the offer. I wonder if they realised they were being played and pulled out. It leave Greece in a difficult position tomorrow. Given that the Greek PM Alexis Tsipras played the victim card today it will be interesting to see what he can spin at the last, (and I assume) final emergency meeting tomorrow.
Either Syriza want to be seen as victims of German punishment when they default, or they are genuinely running out of options.
If I am honest I am quite surprised that they rejected the offer. Although the about face of the Greeks in the negotiations did seem too good to be true. Indeed the EU ministers had a strong hand but the Greeks out of nowhere and back peddled
Something must have appeared really fishy for the Germans to reject the offer. I wonder if they realised they were being played and pulled out. It leave Greece in a difficult position tomorrow. Given that the Greek PM Alexis Tsipras played the victim card today it will be interesting to see what he can spin tomorrow at the last and I assume final emergency meeting.
Either Syriza want to be seen as victims of German punishment when the default or they are genuinely running out of options.
This is why nobody can be sure a deal will be reached. The chances of a Grexit are going up each day.
THE EU was positive about the letter from SYRIZA, it was Germany that refused - showing that this is a problem with Germany as the Greeks have been claiming all along.
Germany and the European Commission appear to be divided over Greece, says the BBC's Mark Lowen in Athens. The German rejection of the Greek proposal after an encouraging EC statement suggests "a rift between Brussels and Berlin at the very highest level on this," he says. "It's not yet clear which side will prevail, and which side will give ground, but clearly the hopes that Greece was moving towards a deal... have been thrown into doubt once again."
THE EU was positive about the letter from SYRIZA, it was Germany that refused - showing that this is a problem with Germany as the Greeks have been claiming all along.
Germany and the European Commission appear to be divided over Greece, says the BBC's Mark Lowen in Athens. The German rejection of the Greek proposal after an encouraging EC statement suggests "a rift between Brussels and Berlin at the very highest level on this," he says. "It's not yet clear which side will prevail, and which side will give ground, but clearly the hopes that Greece was moving towards a deal... have been thrown into doubt once again."
And people say the Germans aren't talking over Europe?
Behind the scenes it has been similar to Ukraine.
Greek joining the Russian block is always a good possibility.
Rumours had it they offered them a deal, Ukraine style !
We will need to hold onto Italy or the scene will be set for a full scale European war.
Behind the scenes it has been similar to Ukraine.
Greek joining the Russian block is always a good possibility.
Rumours had it they offered them a deal, Ukraine style !
We will need to hold onto Italy or the scene will be set for a full scale European war.
Not possible, there are some on here who mistakenly think a major reason for the EEC was to prevent wars.
Behind the scenes it has been similar to Ukraine.
Greek joining the Russian block is always a good possibility.
Rumours had it they offered them a deal, Ukraine style !
We will need to hold onto Italy or the scene will be set for a full scale European war.
The scene is already set eventually by being in the EU or the Euro. It won't need an annexation to Russia for that to happen. Countries will start to rebel against Brussels.
THE EU was positive about the letter from SYRIZA, it was Germany that refused - showing that this is a problem with Germany as the Greeks have been claiming all along.
Germany and the European Commission appear to be divided over Greece, says the BBC's Mark Lowen in Athens. The German rejection of the Greek proposal after an encouraging EC statement suggests "a rift between Brussels and Berlin at the very highest level on this," he says. "It's not yet clear which side will prevail, and which side will give ground, but clearly the hopes that Greece was moving towards a deal... have been thrown into doubt once again."
TO be fair to Germany they are ones that will be lending the bulk of the cash it is their Finance minster Wolfgang Schaeuble who is leading the deal from the European side. Who cares what Jean Claude Juncker thought of the deal I cannot see his Luxembourg standing up much of the cash to support Greece.
Also why you keep banging on about Russia is beyond me. You think when Russia is having to sell off its central banks cash reserve to buy the its own Ruble to prop up its own banks that is is going to find 22 billion to keep Greece going as well.
You keep saying the Russian's like Greece. Well I like chocolate but I doubt cadbury's is going to loan me 22 billion any time soon.
Greece has to pay back 22 billion this year to its creditors. 6-7 billion of this is pure interest.
So it has € 22.37 billion of debt maturing in 2015. It has to deal with this. The usual way would be to pay down some, and refinance the rest. Greece realistically can payoff around € 3.5 billion, leaving € 18.9 billion to finance. If finance is unavailable then the money runs out in March and default occurs.
THE EU was positive about the letter from SYRIZA, it was Germany that refused - showing that this is a problem with Germany as the Greeks have been claiming all along.
Germany and the European Commission appear to be divided over Greece, says the BBC's Mark Lowen in Athens. The German rejection of the Greek proposal after an encouraging EC statement suggests "a rift between Brussels and Berlin at the very highest level on this," he says. "It's not yet clear which side will prevail, and which side will give ground, but clearly the hopes that Greece was moving towards a deal... have been thrown into doubt once again."
Wrong. Negative comments were published today from Slovakia, Latvia, Finland and Germany. The reason that it always appears to be "just" Germany is that the German voice obviously is much more important in this case - as they are the ones who are giving most of the money. You can't blame them for wanting to make sure that Greece does what it promised before.
“This is a red line for us. It would be impossible to explain to the public that ‘poor’ Slovakia . . . should compensate Greece,” Mr Fico told the Financial Times in an interview in his office on Thursday. “To explain to people that we have to give money to Greece for their salaries and pensions? Impossible. Impossible.”
While Germany is frequently portrayed as the biggest obstacle to Greece’s new leftwing government, Slovakia’s hard line is a reminder that Berlin is hardly alone. Officials involved in the talks said Slovakia has been one of the toughest opponents of relaxing the rules governing Greece’s loans.
Comments
As you say, they could do that; the only thing that is preventing it is that the Russian leadership are a gang of mafiosi godfathers who are unlikely give money they need to keep paying their secret policement to a proven deadbeat like Greece
Your knowledge of the Greek Russia bond is ultra poor.
Greece has around Euro 5.6 billion in foreign currency reserves. This could be gone in 3 months with their current trade deficit (Euro 1.7-1.8 billion).
I suspect you are confusing the Euro 68 billion credit line for Greek banks. If the Greeks really had 65 billion lying around, they could pay off a quarter of their national debt.
Greece has to pay back 22 billion this year to its creditors. 6-7 billion of this is pure interest.
You borrow from gangsters you will pay a price one way or another. Even on a national level.
Blimey! You think dealing with the Troika is much different?
The Greeks themselves admire Putin. Both Greeks of the right and left. They are fond of Russia. Always have been. If Greeks have to choose between a master - Germany or Russia, most would pick Russia any day of the week.
Putin likes to visit Mount Athos, has a villa in Greece and the two countries sign pacts for fun. Greeks do not feel vomit in their mouths like many UK liberals do at the mention of Putin.
If I am honest I am quite surprised that they rejected the offer. Although the about face of the Greeks in the negotiations did seem too good to be true. Indeed the EU ministers had a strong hand but the Greeks out of nowhere back peddled and made some strange positive noises compared to their bullish attitude on Monday and Tuesday.
Something must have appeared really fishy for the Germans to reject the offer. I wonder if they realised they were being played and pulled out. It leave Greece in a difficult position tomorrow. Given that the Greek PM Alexis Tsipras played the victim card today it will be interesting to see what he can spin at the last, (and I assume) final emergency meeting tomorrow.
Either Syriza want to be seen as victims of German punishment when they default, or they are genuinely running out of options.
This is why nobody can be sure a deal will be reached. The chances of a Grexit are going up each day.
Germany and the European Commission appear to be divided over Greece, says the BBC's Mark Lowen in Athens. The German rejection of the Greek proposal after an encouraging EC statement suggests "a rift between Brussels and Berlin at the very highest level on this," he says. "It's not yet clear which side will prevail, and which side will give ground, but clearly the hopes that Greece was moving towards a deal... have been thrown into doubt once again."
And people say the Germans aren't talking over Europe?
Greek joining the Russian block is always a good possibility.
Rumours had it they offered them a deal, Ukraine style !
We will need to hold onto Italy or the scene will be set for a full scale European war.
Not possible, there are some on here who mistakenly think a major reason for the EEC was to prevent wars.
The scene is already set eventually by being in the EU or the Euro. It won't need an annexation to Russia for that to happen. Countries will start to rebel against Brussels.
Whether sense prevails, who knows.
It quite rightly, all scares the Church of England too.
Major wars sadly are so so predictable.
TO be fair to Germany they are ones that will be lending the bulk of the cash it is their Finance minster Wolfgang Schaeuble who is leading the deal from the European side. Who cares what Jean Claude Juncker thought of the deal I cannot see his Luxembourg standing up much of the cash to support Greece.
Also why you keep banging on about Russia is beyond me. You think when Russia is having to sell off its central banks cash reserve to buy the its own Ruble to prop up its own banks that is is going to find 22 billion to keep Greece going as well.
You keep saying the Russian's like Greece. Well I like chocolate but I doubt cadbury's is going to loan me 22 billion any time soon.
Nigel Farage wants democratic freedom. The EU doesn't.
Time for the rest of us to stay in the democratic larger EU group, who knows ?
London can go join the Russian Federation.
Is England not allowed democratic freedom then?
So it has € 22.37 billion of debt maturing in 2015. It has to deal with this. The usual way would be to pay down some, and refinance the rest. Greece realistically can payoff around € 3.5 billion, leaving € 18.9 billion to finance. If finance is unavailable then the money runs out in March and default occurs.
Wrong. Negative comments were published today from Slovakia, Latvia, Finland and Germany. The reason that it always appears to be "just" Germany is that the German voice obviously is much more important in this case - as they are the ones who are giving most of the money. You can't blame them for wanting to make sure that Greece does what it promised before.
Here's one example:
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/692bfc12-b831-11e4-86bb-00144feab7de.html#ixzz3SDXG8Hee