A Watts? Sharon couldn't face Ian and they always do hatchet jobs on the icons.
The casual/recent fans don't like Sharon so I can't see the writers who pander to those fans allowing Sharon the "honour" of being the killer. Good point about the hatchet job. Finding a way to make her even more unpopular is probably the only way she'd be allowed to have a big role in this storyline or any other:p
That's the problem. There is quite a fair few fans myself included, that don't like or care about this generation of the Beale family. So I'm afraid I'm not being 'move'd by this storyline.
I would go as far as saying Diederick Santer is a better EP than Dominic Treadwell-Collins. While DS was mediocre at best, at least he didn't put all his eggs in one basket like DTC seems to be doing with this Lucy storyline.
I have to admit I don't care about the Beales. All the Beales/Fowlers I cared about are long gone. The ones who are left are selfish and unlikeable. I did like Peter but even before Lucy's death his character had taken a turn for the worst with the way he was treating Lola.
I think Lucy herself is also one of the problems. The recast never worked for me and I never accepted it was the same character as the previous version. It doesn't feel like the real Lucy has died. It feels like this posh imposter who never fit in has died and I don't really care. I was no fan of Suffield's Lucy but if she'd been killed off I'm certain I'd have connected with this soryline a bit more than I have. The recast continues to be a mistake as far as I'm concerned.
I hope DTC hasn't put all his eggs in the Lucy basket because it hasn't been captivating so far in my opinion.
The problem with the phrases such as 'EastEnders Will Become Best Drama On Television' and 'Walford Will Change Forever', are they are such bold and strong statements to make, and it is nearly impossible for any executive producer to live up to those claims. So in essence, TPTB really are opening themselves up to criticism, especially when the show returns to its distinctively average self a couple of weeks later.
I agree with this. These are bold statements which were never likely to come true. I never allowed myself to think EastEnders was headed into a golden era but I expected something a bit more dynamic and game changing. That could still happen but I have my doubts. The quality has risen in some respects but has stayed the same in many other ways. The best I can say is at least it hasn't gotten worse!:D
That would have been a years worth of s/ls under the last EP;-)
Oh I'm sure there's a lot more to come....it's only been a couple of weeks. People are so impatient
It's not so much impatience but rather being underwhelmed by the story so far. When people say they don't think anyone will care in February I think what they're getting at is that the storyline isn't engaging enough right now.
I know it was deemed a bold move and a big risk to kill off Lucy Beale because she's Ian's daughter and a member of the original family but I disagree. I think it was a safe move. The recast never worked and the character wasn't so big that she was likely to have millions of fans lamenting her death. It should have been a big character who is popular right now. I don't buy the reasoning that the storyline is about a family's grief. The Lucy storyline has become a who done it like any other. Family grief would always play a role in any murder storyline that includes established characters. Recent weeks with David accusing Max of being the killer and Lauren accusing Jake of being the killer smacks of cliched storytelling. Where are these new songs EastEnders was suppposed to be singing?
The casual/recent fans don't like Sharon so I can't see the writers who pander to those fans allowing Sharon the "honour" of being the killer. Good point about the hatchet job. Finding a way to make her even more unpopular is probably the only way she'd be allowed to have a big role in this storyline or any other:p
I have to admit I don't care about the Beales. All the Beales/Fowlers I cared about are long gone. The ones who are left are selfish and unlikeable. I did like Peter but even before Lucy's death his character had taken a turn for the worst with the way he was treating Lola.
I think Lucy herself is also one of the problems. The recast never worked for me and I never accepted it was the same character as the previous version. It doesn't feel like the real Lucy has died. It feels like this posh imposter who never fit in has died and I don't really care. I was no fan of Suffield's Lucy but if she'd been killed off I'm certain I'd have connected with this soryline a bit more than I have. The recast continues to be a mistake as far as I'm concerned.
I hope DTC hasn't put all his eggs in the Lucy basket because it hasn't been captivating so far in my opinion.
I agree with this. These are bold statements which were never likely to come true. I never allowed myself to think EastEnders was headed into a golden era but I expected something a bit more dynamic and game changing. That could still happen but I have my doubts. The quality has risen in some respects but has stayed the same in many other ways. The best I can say is at least it hasn't gotten worse!:D
It's not so much impatience but rather being underwhelmed by the story so far. When people say they don't think anyone will care in February I think what they're getting at is that the storyline isn't engaging enough right now.
I know it was deemed a bold move and a big risk to kill off Lucy Beale because she's Ian's daughter and a member of the original family but I disagree. I think it was a safe move. The recast never worked and the character wasn't so big that she was likely to have millions of fans lamenting her death. It should have been a big character who is popular right now. I don't buy the reasoning that the storyline is about a family's grief. The Lucy storyline has become a who done it like any other. Family grief would always play a role in any murder storyline that includes established characters. Recent weeks with David accusing Max of being the killer and Lauren accusing Jake of being the killer smacks of cliched storytelling. Where are these new songs EastEnders was suppposed to be singing?
Wish Id figured out how to do bit in bold.Underwhelmed rather than impatient sums it up perfectly.I always find it patronsing when people assume lack of patience of intelligence when you dont like a show or story rather than the fact youve intelligently figured out its a pile of crap!
Even though you don't like Ian do you think Adam Woodyatt has been amazing?
To tell you the truth Mormon Girl I've seen it all before. Adam Woodyatt is indeed a good actor but since he's been playing Ian Beale for 30 years and I've been watching it that long I've pretty much seen all he has to offer. So no, I don't think he's been amazing. I think he's been as good as he ever was at playing Ian Beale during a crisis.
Don't mistake my dislike for the character as my disrespect for his longevity and value to the show's history and continuity. Ian may not be a character I like but he's irreplaceable.
Well not enjoying it so far is fine but whining that the ending isn't until February as though it's all about the ending is impatient IMO.
As I've said before, I find your posts unnecessarily rude and abrasive. I would suggest you choose your words more carefully during discussions but I'm not one to tell others how to behave and I think you're well aware of the reaction you'll get by being so contentious;-)
I realise the storyline isn't all about the ending. What I'm saying is I'm underwhelmed by what's happening currently and therefore I can't see myself being bowled over by the climax. That's all.
As I've said before, I find your posts unnecessarily rude and abrasive.
Find them however you please, that's not my problem.
My post wasn't actually about you but about the general attitude towards the storyline which the previous poster was referring to. How nobody is "assuming" a lack of patience when people are outright stating they can't be bothered waiting until February. Again, I never so much as mentioned you or your opinions.
Wish Id figured out how to do bit in bold.Underwhelmed rather than impatient sums it up perfectly.I always find it patronsing when people assume lack of patience of intelligence when you dont like a show or story rather than the fact youve intelligently figured out its a pile of crap!
Great thread by the way Broken Arrow:)
Lol and thank you for the compliment Hildaonpluto:D
I still don't see how any of it will change Walford. It's rare for any storyline to really change life as we know it in a community/area. Most stories have a temporary effect on the community and then everything resets back to the status quo. It will be no different with Lucy's story. dullagi also talked of characters having secrets - that's part and parcel of soaps though. Doesn't mean "Walford will change forever" .
That said, I'm enjoying the storyline overall. Well, the aftermath anyway. The lead up to Lucy's death wasn't great I thought.
I still don't see how any of it will change Walford. It's rare for any storyline to really change life as we know it. Most stories have a temporary effect on the community/area and then everything resets back to the status quo. It will be no different with Lucy's story. dullagi talked of characters having secrets - that's part and parcel of soap. Doesn't mean "Walford will change forever" .
That said, I'm enjoying the storyline overall. Well, the aftermath anyway. The lead up to Lucy's death wasn't great I thought.
All true, T.K Mazin. It's what you expect from a soap:kitty:
I think, whatever the results so far, it was worth doing for the Denise side story alone. That's one part of Who Killed Lucy I am invested in:cool:
I suppose the difference with these secrets is that they're all going to cross via the same Lucy path at some stage so be intertwined and involve them in that central story.
Hopefully anyway, I prefer it like that. For all of the show's faults in 2005, I did enjoy how most characters were involved in plots that all ran into one another.
All true, T.K Mazin. It's what you expect from a soap:kitty:
I think, whatever the results so far, it was worth doing for the Denise side story alone. That's one part of Who Killed Lucy I am invested in:cool:
The only thing I could see changing Walford forever is a disaster of some sort (train crash, plane crash or whatever) that causes a lot of death and destruction in the area. Everybody will literally be affected. I know it's not EE's style to do disasters or mass killings, but I'm just giving an example.
I'm actually finding Denise annoying these days lol. They should never have stuck her with the Beales.
I suppose the difference with these secrets is that they're all going to cross via the same Lucy path at some stage so be intertwined and involve them in that central story.
Hopefully anyway, I prefer it like that. For all of the show's faults in 2005, I did enjoy how most characters were involved in plots that all ran into one another.
I agree. It was great the way all the major characters in 2005 were involved in the murder storyline. It all seemed to fit perfectly together. You could watch the seeds being sown as far back as Den conning The Vic out of Sam's hands. It made perfect sense for the Mitchells to become involved through Sam, the Slaters through Zoe and the Watts/Fowlers/Beales through Sharon. The crowning achievement (no pun intended:p) had to be Den getting his head smashed in with his arch ememy Pauline's doorstop. Payback for getting her teenage daughter knocked up 20 years before:D
I suspect most of these secrets will be red herrings though to keep us guessing. I'm not sure if they will end up having any significance in the story.
Not that I have a problem with that. I like a good red herring.
It would be amusing though if all the characters in the trailer ended up having some sort of link to Lucy .
Shabnam: Lucy's the one who brought me back from Pakistan .
David: I shagged Lucy too
Phil: I gave Lucy the cocaine.
Bianca: She stole my chicken nuggets. How was I meant to feed ma kids?!
Oh of course many of them will be red herrings in regards to Lucy's death. But if it's written well, they will be stories of their own regardless.
The anniversary episode could be a flashback showing her being shoved by each and every character all the way to the common until Ian finally drops a log on her.
The only thing I could see changing Walford forever is a disaster of some sort (train crash, plane crash or whatever) that causes a lot of death and destruction in the area. Everybody will literally be affected. I know it's not EE's style to do disasters or mass killings, but I'm just giving an example.
I'm actually finding Denise annoying these days lol. They should never have stuck her with the Beales.
It would be difficult to change Walford forever unless they destroy The Vic or something:D I wouldn't be surprised if the Beale house burns to the ground though. That house not being there would be a huge change but even with that done it would just be rebuilt a few months later like nothing had happened:D
When they say Walford will change forever I really think they're referring to something long established in the show's continuity. The only thing I can think of is the Mitchell/Beale feud. Maybe it will finally end for good with Ian and Phil killing each other:o
I agree Denise shouldn't have gone back and I never wanted her with Ian but I'm finding her storyline fascinating and very sad. She's one of the very few characters I actively root for.
I agree about the aftermath of Den's murder. It made perfect sense to involve the three familes due to Chrissie, Sam and Zoe's involvement in the murder and felt organic the way it was told.
It would be difficult to change Walford forever unless they destroy The Vic or something:D I wouldn't be surprised if the Beale house burns to the ground though. That house not being there would be a huge change but even with that done it would just be rebuilt a few months later like nothing had happened:D
When they say Walford will change forever I really think they're referring to something long established in the show's continuity. The only thing I can think of is the Mitchell/Beale feud. Maybe it will finally end for good with Ian and Phil killing each other:o
I agree Denise shouldn't have gone back and I never wanted her with Ian but I'm finding her storyline fascinating and very sad. She's one of the very few characters I actively root for.
Im so glad Diane Parish didnt jump ship in 2012.She makes Denise feel so multi layered and relatable.Could you imagine this story being done under the 2012 conditions of Branning overload?!:o
It would be difficult to change Walford forever unless they destroy The Vic or something:D I wouldn't be surprised if the Beale house burns to the ground though. That house not being there would be a huge change but even with that done it would just be rebuilt a few months later like nothing had happened:D
When they say Walford will change forever I really think they're referring to something long established in the show's continuity. The only thing I can think of is the Mitchell/Beale feud. Maybe it will finally end for good with Ian and Phil killing each other
I agree Denise shouldn't have gone back and I never wanted her with Ian but I'm finding her storyline fascinating and very sad. She's one of the very few characters I actively root for.
Exactly.
Or maybe Phil and Ian will finally give into their feelings for one another? ;-)
That would certainly change Walford forever!
What IS Denise's story exactly? She wants to leave Ian and keeps crying about it like a mope lol. Someone needs to tell Denise what Ian and Jane did on the living room carpet . That should give her the push to finally end it with Ian.
I preferred Denise when she was being terrorised by the likes of Lucas and Owen .
Oh of course many of them will be red herrings in regards to Lucy's death. But if it's written well, they will be stories of their own regardless.
The anniversary episode could be a flashback showing her being shoved by each and every character all the way to the common until Ian finally drops a log on her.
Ha Ha . That could be an episode of Family Guy with Stewie dropping the log instead .
Or maybe Phil and Ian will finally give into their feelings for one another? ;-)
That would certainly change Walford forever!
What IS Denise's story exactly? She wants to leave Ian and keeps crying about it like a mope lol. Someone needs to tell Denise what Ian and Jane did on the living room carpet . That should give her the push to finally end it with Ian.
I preferred Denise when she was being terrorised by the likes of Lucas and Owen .
It would change me forever. I don't think I'd ever recover from seeing that sight:o:D
Denise is too good for Ian. He never deserved her. I think she feels obligated to the Beales because she was Ian's partner when Lucy died. I think she should just leave them. None of them have ever given her any respect and she owes them nothing. The woman is a saint!
Denise's story is she wants to leave Ian but is trapped in the relationship because of Lucy. She feels she can't dump him and she thought Jane would be her saving grace but she has buggered off. Denise is going through the pain of staying in a relationship she hates, the loss of Lucy and supporting Ian.
Denise's story is she wants to leave Ian but is trapped in the relationship because of Lucy. She feels she can't dump him and she thought Jane would be her saving grace but she has buggered off. Denise is going through the pain of staying in a relationship she hates, the loss of Lucy and supporting Ian.
I really do like this aspect of the storyline and Diane has been absolutely fantastic. You do feel sorry for Denise, especially how she's been treated but on the other hand Ian needs someone to take care of him so you can see why Denise has stayed with him so far. Things will come to a head eventually though and I can see Denise leaving him, probably back into the arms of Fatboy.
Comments
No Im amused!Hes a flash in the pan going by most responses.Lets not derail this thread with banter!
The casual/recent fans don't like Sharon so I can't see the writers who pander to those fans allowing Sharon the "honour" of being the killer. Good point about the hatchet job. Finding a way to make her even more unpopular is probably the only way she'd be allowed to have a big role in this storyline or any other:p
I have to admit I don't care about the Beales. All the Beales/Fowlers I cared about are long gone. The ones who are left are selfish and unlikeable. I did like Peter but even before Lucy's death his character had taken a turn for the worst with the way he was treating Lola.
I think Lucy herself is also one of the problems. The recast never worked for me and I never accepted it was the same character as the previous version. It doesn't feel like the real Lucy has died. It feels like this posh imposter who never fit in has died and I don't really care. I was no fan of Suffield's Lucy but if she'd been killed off I'm certain I'd have connected with this soryline a bit more than I have. The recast continues to be a mistake as far as I'm concerned.
I hope DTC hasn't put all his eggs in the Lucy basket because it hasn't been captivating so far in my opinion.
I agree with this. These are bold statements which were never likely to come true. I never allowed myself to think EastEnders was headed into a golden era but I expected something a bit more dynamic and game changing. That could still happen but I have my doubts. The quality has risen in some respects but has stayed the same in many other ways. The best I can say is at least it hasn't gotten worse!:D
It's not so much impatience but rather being underwhelmed by the story so far. When people say they don't think anyone will care in February I think what they're getting at is that the storyline isn't engaging enough right now.
I know it was deemed a bold move and a big risk to kill off Lucy Beale because she's Ian's daughter and a member of the original family but I disagree. I think it was a safe move. The recast never worked and the character wasn't so big that she was likely to have millions of fans lamenting her death. It should have been a big character who is popular right now. I don't buy the reasoning that the storyline is about a family's grief. The Lucy storyline has become a who done it like any other. Family grief would always play a role in any murder storyline that includes established characters. Recent weeks with David accusing Max of being the killer and Lauren accusing Jake of being the killer smacks of cliched storytelling. Where are these new songs EastEnders was suppposed to be singing?
Wish Id figured out how to do bit in bold.Underwhelmed rather than impatient sums it up perfectly.I always find it patronsing when people assume lack of patience of intelligence when you dont like a show or story rather than the fact youve intelligently figured out its a pile of crap!
Great thread by the way Broken Arrow:)
To tell you the truth Mormon Girl I've seen it all before. Adam Woodyatt is indeed a good actor but since he's been playing Ian Beale for 30 years and I've been watching it that long I've pretty much seen all he has to offer. So no, I don't think he's been amazing. I think he's been as good as he ever was at playing Ian Beale during a crisis.
Don't mistake my dislike for the character as my disrespect for his longevity and value to the show's history and continuity. Ian may not be a character I like but he's irreplaceable.
As I've said before, I find your posts unnecessarily rude and abrasive. I would suggest you choose your words more carefully during discussions but I'm not one to tell others how to behave and I think you're well aware of the reaction you'll get by being so contentious;-)
I realise the storyline isn't all about the ending. What I'm saying is I'm underwhelmed by what's happening currently and therefore I can't see myself being bowled over by the climax. That's all.
Find them however you please, that's not my problem.
My post wasn't actually about you but about the general attitude towards the storyline which the previous poster was referring to. How nobody is "assuming" a lack of patience when people are outright stating they can't be bothered waiting until February. Again, I never so much as mentioned you or your opinions.
Good for you, but again, nothing to do with my post.
Lol and thank you for the compliment Hildaonpluto:D
That said, I'm enjoying the storyline overall. Well, the aftermath anyway. The lead up to Lucy's death wasn't great I thought.
All true, T.K Mazin. It's what you expect from a soap:kitty:
I think, whatever the results so far, it was worth doing for the Denise side story alone. That's one part of Who Killed Lucy I am invested in:cool:
Hopefully anyway, I prefer it like that. For all of the show's faults in 2005, I did enjoy how most characters were involved in plots that all ran into one another.
The only thing I could see changing Walford forever is a disaster of some sort (train crash, plane crash or whatever) that causes a lot of death and destruction in the area. Everybody will literally be affected. I know it's not EE's style to do disasters or mass killings, but I'm just giving an example.
I'm actually finding Denise annoying these days lol. They should never have stuck her with the Beales.
I agree. It was great the way all the major characters in 2005 were involved in the murder storyline. It all seemed to fit perfectly together. You could watch the seeds being sown as far back as Den conning The Vic out of Sam's hands. It made perfect sense for the Mitchells to become involved through Sam, the Slaters through Zoe and the Watts/Fowlers/Beales through Sharon. The crowning achievement (no pun intended:p) had to be Den getting his head smashed in with his arch ememy Pauline's doorstop. Payback for getting her teenage daughter knocked up 20 years before:D
Not that I have a problem with that. I like a good red herring.
It would be amusing though if all the characters in the trailer ended up having some sort of link to Lucy
Shabnam: Lucy's the one who brought me back from Pakistan
David: I shagged Lucy too
Phil: I gave Lucy the cocaine.
Bianca: She stole my chicken nuggets. How was I meant to feed ma kids?!
The anniversary episode could be a flashback showing her being shoved by each and every character all the way to the common until Ian finally drops a log on her.
It would be difficult to change Walford forever unless they destroy The Vic or something:D I wouldn't be surprised if the Beale house burns to the ground though. That house not being there would be a huge change but even with that done it would just be rebuilt a few months later like nothing had happened:D
When they say Walford will change forever I really think they're referring to something long established in the show's continuity. The only thing I can think of is the Mitchell/Beale feud. Maybe it will finally end for good with Ian and Phil killing each other:o
I agree Denise shouldn't have gone back and I never wanted her with Ian but I'm finding her storyline fascinating and very sad. She's one of the very few characters I actively root for.
Exactly.
Or maybe Phil and Ian will finally give into their feelings for one another? ;-)
That would certainly change Walford forever!
What IS Denise's story exactly? She wants to leave Ian and keeps crying about it like a mope lol. Someone needs to tell Denise what Ian and Jane did on the living room carpet
I preferred Denise when she was being terrorised by the likes of Lucas and Owen
Ha Ha
It would change me forever. I don't think I'd ever recover from seeing that sight:o:D
Denise is too good for Ian. He never deserved her. I think she feels obligated to the Beales because she was Ian's partner when Lucy died. I think she should just leave them. None of them have ever given her any respect and she owes them nothing. The woman is a saint!
I really do like this aspect of the storyline and Diane has been absolutely fantastic. You do feel sorry for Denise, especially how she's been treated but on the other hand Ian needs someone to take care of him so you can see why Denise has stayed with him so far. Things will come to a head eventually though and I can see Denise leaving him, probably back into the arms of Fatboy.