I used to always think of Vauxhall cars and Luton Vans when I thought of Luton.Now all I ever hear about is religious nut jobs who hate the UK.They are quite keen on all of the benefits available mind.I can't imagine what it must be like to live there.:(
I'm sure that hate preacher guy Chowdray actually sees it as part of his plan to bring down the UK from the inside.I know Hook used to say that.'Take everything going'.
I just think perhaps we could somehow make people like that see sense eventually.
People are varied. Just because we don't like their viewpoint doesn't mean they haven't thought it out. Do you seriously believe that many people immigrated to IS without a lot of thought and discussion and research?
They have chosen to go. Some will like it and some won't. We are still a free country. It's their choice and they will live with the consequences of their choices.
They must be bloody mad if they think IS will be wonderful. It's like moths that are being drawn to a flame. They're obviously ignoring all the negative things that has been reported about this poisonous cult. Why do they think that some have left this dangerous and brutal cult for?
It's their choice, they are from the UK, which they despise and where that choice is allowed. They aren't daft impressionable kids and they are obviousIy extremists themselves to believe that lot of nonsense. I couldn't care less and hope everyone else who shares their strident fervour for brutality, poverty el al, in their dream of a totalitarian state, joins them ASAP. The sooner the new counter terrorism proposals are made law the better. Who knows, we may see more of a dramatic exodus.
Downing Street said that there will also be a “strengthened” role for Ofcom to ensure it is able to take swift action against television channels or radio stations which broadcast extremist content."
Under the Coalition government, the plans to increase anti-terror plans were repeatedly blocked by Nick Clegg and the Liberal Democrats. Senior Tories had accused the Lib Dems of putting national security at risk by opposing the measures.
The decision to fast-track the legislation follows the rise of extremist organisations such as Isil in Syria and Iraq.
Why so much coverage of this story? Really rather odd. There is an obsession with bowing to Muslims in this country nowadays it would seem, actually no just the more extreme minded ones always moaning about the place while taking advantage of it. I feel sorry for the many, many normal folk for whom their religion is private and they are more than contributing to the country in their daily lives. No idea what the media's agenda is with all this crap.
It's clear to me that they are on the wind up with the letter and they are in fact just mentally unstable. I mean they know fine well that no matter how you look at it, Syria is not a better place to live than the UK. It is literally insane to think that. These people and anyone else who goes there are definitely mentally deficient. They should have their citizenship revoked and made stateless and if they attempt to re-enter the UK at any point in the future, be denied entry and sent back to Syria (or whatever bit of Islamic State they settle in), their new home. They have denied themselves of any human rights from a recognised state by running off to fight for an unrecognised one.
I mean they can't be of sound mind and claim that they are living in a more socially adjusted society or whatever it is they are claiming Syria is?
They don't love their children, that's for sure. No sane, loving parent would take their kids away from a modern, well adjusted society to that shithole. I know plenty of Muslims who wouldn't touch IS with a barge pole and would gladly and rightly fight against them in the name of Islam, so whatever these lunatics think they are doing it's 100% wrong!
It's clear to me that they are on the wind up with the letter and they are in fact just mentally unstable. I mean they know fine well that no matter how you look at it, Syria is not a better place to live than the UK. It is literally insane to think that. These people and anyone else who goes there are definitely mentally deficient. They should have their citizenship revoked and made stateless and if they attempt to re-enter the UK at any point in the future, be denied entry and sent back to Syria (or whatever bit of Islamic State they settle in), their new home. They have denied themselves of any human rights from a recognised state by running off to fight for an unrecognised one.
I mean they can't be of sound mind and claim that they are living in a more socially adjusted society or whatever it is they are claiming Syria is?
They don't love their children, that's for sure. No sane, loving parent would take their kids away from a modern, well adjusted society to that shithole. I know plenty of Muslims who wouldn't touch IS with a barge pole and would gladly and rightly fight against them in the name of Islam, so whatever these lunatics think they are doing it's 100% wrong!
If you think IS are mentally deficient then apply that as necessary. They are all from some family or other. They agree with IS and want that way of barbaric non-life, it's that simple.
Why so much coverage of this story? Really rather odd. There is an obsession with bowing to Muslims in this country nowadays it would seem, actually no just the more extreme minded ones always moaning about the place while taking advantage of it. I feel sorry for the many, many normal folk for whom their religion is private and they are more than contributing to the country in their daily lives. No idea what the media's agenda is with all this crap.
Has there been? I just came across the story when someone posted it on Farcebook, I hadn't heard of it at all.
If anything I think the authorities are downplaying this. How many families have to disappear before we stop classing this as a "loony few" and realise there is a significant and sizeable minority in this country who we have lost.
How many families have to disappear before we stop classing this as a "loony few" and realise there is a significant and sizeable minority in this country who we have lost.
If it was a significant minority then 12 people going wouldn't be big news. I think a small number of people want to join IS, aa larger minority share their philosophy and a larger number refuse to see the link between sections of their beliefs and how it leads to the minorities actions.
If it was a significant minority then 12 people going wouldn't be big news. I think a small number of people want to join IS, aa larger minority share their philosophy and a larger number refuse to see the link between sections of their beliefs and how it leads to the minorities actions.
How can we be sure? We simply have no way of knowing until it is too late and they've buggered off to Turkey. We've had a steady drip of families/youngsters leaving for quite some time, now - you would assume more are to come - so at what point does it change from a looney few to a significant minority who are willing to leave the UK for IS?
I know civil freedoms should trump all, but honestly - maybe pull the shutters down on people going to Turkey/Syria etc and properly enforce it.
If you think IS are mentally deficient then apply that as necessary. They are all from some family or other. They agree with IS and want that way of barbaric non-life, it's that simple.
They can't be made stateless.
I know they can't be made stateless, but just wish they could be.
They have chosen to align with Islamic State, a self-proclaimed territory which is under control of the caliphate. If they take up IS citizenship then they wouldn't be stateless as such. However as IS statehood doesn't exist yet I suppose they could become stateless. They have still chosen to go there and dismiss the way of life in the UK, so why can't the UK make them stateless exactly?
What is physically stopping the UK government from cancelling their passports and denying them entry if they ever return?
You can't stop the government from doing so and I know people would moan and cry about it being a stepping stone to the government being able to deport anyone they disagreed with but realistically all it would actually be is the government stopping people who have gone to fight against their country from being able to come back.
Why is that an issue?
Why must these people be given the right to remain British citizens who are free to come and go from this country just because they were born here (I am assuming they were). They have chosen to leave and fight against us. They aren't doing things that normal people do. They aren't on holiday, they haven't held a protest in Parliament Square against NHS cuts and they haven't set up an anti-government blog or even a pro IS blog, all of which is clearly not grounds to remove citizenship. They have gone abroad to a terrorist controlled area to support the killing and torturing of British people (and our allies) and contribute to the violent destruction of world heritage sites and that's just for starters. The normal rules should not apply, this is new territory now. They need to be made stateless and be shown the UK will not just accept people back who do these things.
But what do you do? Where would we exile British citizens that support terrorist organisations we don't like?
Even if they were to saunter up at Heathrow arrivals tomorrow, we would have to let them back home.
Why, as far as I'm concerned they have left the country to become citizens of another state. If they had decided to emigrate to Australia & become citizens there would we have to let them back - I think people like anjem choudary who actively support ISIS and think living in the caliphate is so wonderful should be offered a one way ticket to Raqqa
I know civil freedoms should trump all, but honestly - maybe pull the shutters down on people going to Turkey/Syria etc and properly enforce it.
Then we'd be locked in with them and their warped views and their hate and their children being brought up in the same way.
Let them go there if they want.
I know they can't be made stateless, but just wish they could be.
They have chosen to align with Islamic State, a self-proclaimed territory which is under control of the caliphate. If they take up IS citizenship then they wouldn't be stateless as such. However as IS statehood doesn't exist yet I suppose they could become stateless. They have still chosen to go there and dismiss the way of life in the UK, so why can't the UK make them stateless exactly?
What is physically stopping the UK government from cancelling their passports and denying them entry if they ever return?
You can't stop the government from doing so and I know people would moan and cry about it being a stepping stone to the government being able to deport anyone they disagreed with but realistically all it would actually be is the government stopping people who have gone to fight against their country from being able to come back.
Why is that an issue?
Why must these people be given the right to remain British citizens who are free to come and go from this country just because they were born here (I am assuming they were). They have chosen to leave and fight against us. They aren't doing things that normal people do. They aren't on holiday, they haven't held a protest in Parliament Square against NHS cuts and they haven't set up an anti-government blog or even a pro IS blog, all of which is clearly not grounds to remove citizenship. They have gone abroad to a terrorist controlled area to support the killing and torturing of British people (and our allies) and contribute to the violent destruction of world heritage sites and that's just for starters. The normal rules should not apply, this is new territory now. They need to be made stateless and be shown the UK will not just accept people back who do these things.
First BIB, and a lot more of your post.The UK has laws to deal with anyone associated with a proscribed regime like IS. If they are and return they will be arrested and dealt with by our legal system. If they return and we make them stateless where do they go? They can't go anywhere. The same applies to making anyone stateless in another country, you're assuming that country will accept them. They are ultimately the UK's responsibility.
Our current laws and as far as we are allowed to go. If they have dual nationality and if the other country will accept them, they can lose UK citizenship. If they don't have dual citizenship and any other sovereign state will accept them the same applies. Personally I never want to be a citizen of any uncivilised country which would make anyone stateless. I prefer law to any despot regime action.
Then we'd be locked in with them and their warped views and their hate and their children being brought up in the same way.
Let them go there if they want.
It's better and safer for everyone if no-one goes there. The danger they would pose on returning after spending time with hardened radicals doesn't bear thinking about.
I know the knee-jerk response is, "Good! Don't come back!" but the reality is they hold British passports, and have every right associated with that until they actually commit a crime. Just being in Syria isn't breaking any laws as far as I can tell.
First BIB, and a lot more of your post.The UK has laws to deal with anyone associated with a proscribed regime like IS. If they are and return they will be arrested and dealt with by our legal system. If they return and we make them stateless where do they go? They can't go anywhere. The same applies to making anyone stateless in another country, you're assuming that country will accept them. They are ultimately the UK's responsibility.
Our current laws and as far as we are allowed to go. If they have dual nationality and if the other country will accept them, they can lose UK citizenship. If they don't have dual citizenship and any other sovereign state will accept them the same applies. Personally I never want to be a citizen of any uncivilised country which would make anyone stateless. I prefer law to any despot regime action.
They are citizens of the caliphate and should be returned there
Comments
Stand up for the murdered people in Tunisia. They might have done in their community.
But what do you do? Where would we exile British citizens that support terrorist organisations we don't like?
Even if they were to saunter up at Heathrow arrivals tomorrow, we would have to let them back home.
I just think perhaps we could somehow make people like that see sense eventually.
Who?
..
I used to always think of Vauxhall cars and Luton Vans when I thought of Luton.Now all I ever hear about is religious nut jobs who hate the UK.They are quite keen on all of the benefits available mind.I can't imagine what it must be like to live there.:(
I'm sure that hate preacher guy Chowdray actually sees it as part of his plan to bring down the UK from the inside.I know Hook used to say that.'Take everything going'.
If I despised a country as much as that lot I'd leave. I really more follow this family.
People are varied. Just because we don't like their viewpoint doesn't mean they haven't thought it out. Do you seriously believe that many people immigrated to IS without a lot of thought and discussion and research?
They have chosen to go. Some will like it and some won't. We are still a free country. It's their choice and they will live with the consequences of their choices.
It's their choice, they are from the UK, which they despise and where that choice is allowed. They aren't daft impressionable kids and they are obviousIy extremists themselves to believe that lot of nonsense. I couldn't care less and hope everyone else who shares their strident fervour for brutality, poverty el al, in their dream of a totalitarian state, joins them ASAP. The sooner the new counter terrorism proposals are made law the better. Who knows, we may see more of a dramatic exodus.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2...-david-cameron
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...rror-laws.html
I mean they can't be of sound mind and claim that they are living in a more socially adjusted society or whatever it is they are claiming Syria is?
They don't love their children, that's for sure. No sane, loving parent would take their kids away from a modern, well adjusted society to that shithole. I know plenty of Muslims who wouldn't touch IS with a barge pole and would gladly and rightly fight against them in the name of Islam, so whatever these lunatics think they are doing it's 100% wrong!
If you think IS are mentally deficient then apply that as necessary. They are all from some family or other. They agree with IS and want that way of barbaric non-life, it's that simple.
They can't be made stateless.
Has there been? I just came across the story when someone posted it on Farcebook, I hadn't heard of it at all.
If anything I think the authorities are downplaying this. How many families have to disappear before we stop classing this as a "loony few" and realise there is a significant and sizeable minority in this country who we have lost.
If it was a significant minority then 12 people going wouldn't be big news. I think a small number of people want to join IS, aa larger minority share their philosophy and a larger number refuse to see the link between sections of their beliefs and how it leads to the minorities actions.
Helps to fund something I suppose.
A bunch of terrorists are far less of a danger to us in Syria than they are here so let them stay there.
How can we be sure? We simply have no way of knowing until it is too late and they've buggered off to Turkey. We've had a steady drip of families/youngsters leaving for quite some time, now - you would assume more are to come - so at what point does it change from a looney few to a significant minority who are willing to leave the UK for IS?
I know civil freedoms should trump all, but honestly - maybe pull the shutters down on people going to Turkey/Syria etc and properly enforce it.
I know they can't be made stateless, but just wish they could be.
They have chosen to align with Islamic State, a self-proclaimed territory which is under control of the caliphate. If they take up IS citizenship then they wouldn't be stateless as such. However as IS statehood doesn't exist yet I suppose they could become stateless. They have still chosen to go there and dismiss the way of life in the UK, so why can't the UK make them stateless exactly?
What is physically stopping the UK government from cancelling their passports and denying them entry if they ever return?
You can't stop the government from doing so and I know people would moan and cry about it being a stepping stone to the government being able to deport anyone they disagreed with but realistically all it would actually be is the government stopping people who have gone to fight against their country from being able to come back.
Why is that an issue?
Why must these people be given the right to remain British citizens who are free to come and go from this country just because they were born here (I am assuming they were). They have chosen to leave and fight against us. They aren't doing things that normal people do. They aren't on holiday, they haven't held a protest in Parliament Square against NHS cuts and they haven't set up an anti-government blog or even a pro IS blog, all of which is clearly not grounds to remove citizenship. They have gone abroad to a terrorist controlled area to support the killing and torturing of British people (and our allies) and contribute to the violent destruction of world heritage sites and that's just for starters. The normal rules should not apply, this is new territory now. They need to be made stateless and be shown the UK will not just accept people back who do these things.
Why, as far as I'm concerned they have left the country to become citizens of another state. If they had decided to emigrate to Australia & become citizens there would we have to let them back - I think people like anjem choudary who actively support ISIS and think living in the caliphate is so wonderful should be offered a one way ticket to Raqqa
Then we'd be locked in with them and their warped views and their hate and their children being brought up in the same way.
Let them go there if they want.
Don't you know that ISIS has a wonderful NHS?
First BIB, and a lot more of your post.The UK has laws to deal with anyone associated with a proscribed regime like IS. If they are and return they will be arrested and dealt with by our legal system. If they return and we make them stateless where do they go? They can't go anywhere. The same applies to making anyone stateless in another country, you're assuming that country will accept them. They are ultimately the UK's responsibility.
Our current laws and as far as we are allowed to go. If they have dual nationality and if the other country will accept them, they can lose UK citizenship. If they don't have dual citizenship and any other sovereign state will accept them the same applies. Personally I never want to be a citizen of any uncivilised country which would make anyone stateless. I prefer law to any despot regime action.
It's better and safer for everyone if no-one goes there. The danger they would pose on returning after spending time with hardened radicals doesn't bear thinking about.
I know the knee-jerk response is, "Good! Don't come back!" but the reality is they hold British passports, and have every right associated with that until they actually commit a crime. Just being in Syria isn't breaking any laws as far as I can tell.
Because its dribs and drabs. For a sense of perspective remember there were far more far right supporters in the UK during WWII
They are citizens of the caliphate and should be returned there