I think it could only be called a fix if the released figures were manipulated, which clearly they havent been considering the fallout and controversy of the bottom 2 voting figures!
Damned if you do and damned if you dont. No point in having judges vote off if they should reflect the actual votes. I think thats the next debate. Either go the way of Strictly (where judges had some say in the voting but not in the bottom 2) or dont have a say in the voting at all but still have the bottom 2 sing-off vote power. Otherwise why even bother with judges?!?
As for Matt's future, I do worry that he will get manipulated too much for his own good and will end up getting nowhere. Keeping fingers crossed that he has a big say in his direction/styling/promotion and that will give him a more Will Young type future as opposed to a Joe McElderry type future. When I heard that my 2 favourite stand out songs off the show were also on his winners CD, even I am tempted to make the purchase. And I've never bought ANYTHING as a result of the X-factor!!! I loved the way he really gave some songs new angles and styles in delivery, that was the talent aside from the top notes!
It makes quite interesting reading. Matt had this in the bag from week 1, clinching top stop every single week.
Katie would have left week 1 on votes, Belle week 2, Trayc week 3, Cher week 7.
The top 5 were pretty consistently made up of Matt, OD, Mary, Rebecca, Cher. With Mary pipping Cher to the final Saturday.
So, in actual fact, the end results were as they should be.
The fun and games really lies in the bottom batch. Katie, Bella Amie and Treyc being saved despite polling the least votes in weeks 1-3 and FYD, Diva Fever and John leaving despite coming 3rd from bottom.
Despite Katie polling 2nd to last in week one, she would have always won her sing off's if it went to deadlock and she had the greatest leap from consistent bottom 2 to top 2 in week 7 before crashing back to lowest votes in week 8.
Aiden backs up the theory of poor song choice effecting votes. Comfortably sitting in middle ground ahead of Paije and Wagner until week 6 where he crashed to lowest number of votes, meaning Wagner sails through in his place. I think Aiden would have made it to week 8 otherwise.
Paije was very consistent in polling 6th most weeks, leaving the show at the point he should have.
What is a shock is how small a % of the audience actually vote. 15 million across 10 weeks is not good for a show that was pulling in 10 million + and this is an area they need to address going forward. How do they try to get the viewers to vote? 90% of missing viewers votes could provide a widely different result.
Mary had 22.28 to Matts 15.14 so Mary won week one. But apart from that, Matt was top every week.
Reading all 11 of these pages is possibly little heavy going for me, but I will make a few comments on what I feel is noteworthy about these statistics.
1. If there is one thing I will applaud, that is this set of figures have clearly not been manipulated in anyway. Because it is in effect quite an incriminating document!
2. Incriminating in respect that the whole 'deadlock' scenario is now discredited. I cannot comment on Simon - it is his show. But it also seems clear to me that Dannii, Cheryl and Louis have no independence when it comes to who they are actually voting to save/eliminate. Almost every time it did not go to deadlock, the act with a bigger share of the vote went.
3. Simon has got to start treating male contestants and female contestants equally. Aside from the fawning over 1D, judges repeatedly saved female acts over male acts. Week 1 Katie over FYD (Katie had a worse vote). Week 2 Belle Amie over Diva Fever (Belle Amie had a worse vote) Week 3 Tracey over John (Tracey had a worse vote, though I accept John choked the sing-off) Week 4 , 5 and 6 girls were up against each other in a situation created by weeks 1, 2 and 3. Week 7 Cher over Paije (Cher had a worse vote)
4. One Direction were never in the race. Unlucky, Simon!
5. Matt has been ahead since week 2.
6. I thought Rebecca had blown it after the duet with Christina. Incredibly, despite Matt's sizzling hot duet with Rihanna, he actually lost a huge chunk of his lead between Saturday and Sunday halfway point. In between, Rebecca blew the roof off the building with her rendition of Sweet Dreams.
7. Wagner never polled more than 10.48% (in the week that he went out), and therefore was never in contention. So Simon's 'derailing the show' rant can be added to his list of b******s this series. The worst that happened was that we were stuck with him for longer than we would have wished.
8. Cher and Katie in particular were the net beneficiaries of every sending-home decision by the judges. This myth by some forum posters about acts like them keeping the show interesting continues to be peddled. The voting percentages show at best viewers were ambivalent about them.
9. Mary and Aiden were dropping votes nearly every week, as viewers realised neither were as good as they first thought. Mary won week one!
10. Who were the nutters who voted for Katie in week 7? It shows that when it comes down to it, viewers can be manipulated.
11. But the master cannot control everything, and at least the final is relatively untouched by judges' interference. Simon's attempts to make Matt look foolish with the sickbed video and the snide remarks about "just getting on with it" did not have the effect of a Rebecca or 1D win. Awww shame!
Oh and as we suspected Abigail was the biggest fake on this forum. One Direction topping the votes??? I dont think so love!!! Goodbye!!!
All Abigail showed was that you can correctly predict the outcome to a certain extent. And I said in one of those threads that I have been getting equally accurate predictions about who goes from the spoof Katie Weasel twitter. (Usually the acts she poked fun at as being the ones who should 'pack their bags' or 'we're singing the countdown theme to' were indeed the ones who went that week!)
Has anyone worked out what the percentage between Matt and Rebecca was. I understand it was 44 to 38 including the others but how did they finish in the final two split?
Has anyone worked out what the percentage between Matt and Rebecca was. I understand it was 44 to 38 including the others but how did they finish in the final two split?
he was top after week 1 sulla ...he got his fan base because he consistently delivered songs better than any other contestant ..if he hadn't other people would have got fan bases which threatened his stronghold
TOP every week except for WEEK 1 is hardly relying on two songs
He impressed every week but those are the songs that sealed it for him. Quite rightly IMO. I note that they are both on the CD that is being released and which I may well buy.
I think it could only be called a fix if the released figures were manipulated, which clearly they havent been considering the fallout and controversy of the bottom 2 voting figures!
Damned if you do and damned if you dont. No point in having judges vote off if they should reflect the actual votes. I think thats the next debate. Either go the way of Strictly (where judges had some say in the voting but not in the bottom 2) or dont have a say in the voting at all but still have the bottom 2 sing-off vote power. Otherwise why even bother with judges?!?
As for Matt's future, I do worry that he will get manipulated too much for his own good and will end up getting nowhere. Keeping fingers crossed that he has a big say in his direction/styling/promotion and that will give him a more Will Young type future as opposed to a Joe McElderry type future. When I heard that my 2 favourite stand out songs off the show were also on his winners CD, even I am tempted to make the purchase. And I've never bought ANYTHING as a result of the X-factor!!! I loved the way he really gave some songs new angles and styles in delivery, that was the talent aside from the top notes!
Well done Matt!
I too hope that he does a 'Will Young' and can carve out his own career by being strong enough to stand up to the Syco lot. He certainly seems keen to get on and write his own stuff - good for him.
Interestingly, the last time I bought a winners single was Will Young (all those years ago) and I have bought Matt's today.
try to spin it any way you like, the fact is that cher was more popular than paije throughout the show. and this is backed up by the number of her fans on all the internet media too. but let's just wait and see how well they both do after the show is over, then we will be able to judge their popularity better.
Cher is not more popular than Paiige and it is not spin, the facts are that Paiige was getting more of a share of the public vote each week, (His vote was growing in the end to more than Cher).
Cher on the other hand was still only receiving the same Teeny Vote and most of those are kids voting twice or more.
Despite getting the Pimp slots a lot of the time, Cher from Week 6 onwards was polling low in the votes. and whatever way you may like it to be. The proof is there for all to see and hear. Lol. Paiige is easily the better singer and he sings very well.
As regards see who's more popular after the show ends, Cher will get pushed on the kids as she got iin to the final, albeit grossly unfairly and Paiige will get no help but even then I think both will disappear without trace within a year . Paiige has a better personality and he is a far superior singer, Cher is just shrill and vile.
Cher and the judges stole Marys rightful place in the final and the truth is Cher shouldn't have got past the Judges house as she never actually performed but nowadays society seems to reward the wrong kind of people:D
After Cher left the remaining three acts split the vote:-
Matt 39.8%
Rebecca 37.9%
One Direction 22.3%
After One Direction were eliminated the final two split the vote:-
Matt 52.2%
Rebecca 47.8%
Just over one quarter (25.7%) of all the final week's votes were placed before Freeze 1 on Saturday, when Cher was knocked out
Just over one third (35.5%) of all the final week's votes were placed between Freeze 1 on Saturday and Freeze 2 on Sunday evening, when One Direction left
The heaviest voting period of all was when it was down to the final two, with 38.8% of all the final week's votes being given.
Two things strike me as interesting...
1. How close the vote split was between Matt and Rebecca once it came down to the final three, and then the final two
2. By far the heaviest voting (given the relatively short time period) occurred when it came down to the final two, Matt and Rebecca
I initially thought "what a stinking carve up" but then I thought y'know what.... stay out of bottom 3 and you're fire-proof and through to next week. It is galling how the order in which contestants were voted off was distorted by random deadlocks/double-evictions but it all came out in the wash... Matt was the rightful winner and who cares about the rest?
Next year, just don't vote OR believe a single view/statement made by a judge; some of the proclaimations Cowell made about manifestly not popular acts like Waissel, Cher and to some extent 1D now look even more laughable than when he originally blurted them out.
You obviously still don't get it.
The judges vote in the sing-off is whom they want to go through, who they think performed best or will develop most, whatever the vote was that put them in the bottom two.
They seem to move the goal posts of what a good sing off performance is most of the time.
Oh yea I agree, thats how these shows work though, even out here in america with american idol the judges always push there favorites to the front. the ultimately want the contestants they feel can be popstars on the charts right now. Being from America I know Cher could easily cross over here with the right material, because her style of music is whats current all over the charts right now. When u have a record label and u are about to put millions of dollars into one of these people understandably they are going to push certain contestants with favoritism.
Completely agree with all of this response. I watch American idol and see some of the same tricks there, and due to the Cowell connection both shows use songs from there that they know are successful /not, as the case may be. It is fascinating to watch Cowell praise a song choice that he rubbished across the pond and so on, which adds to all of the theories about the comments being used as part of the manipulation.
I also agree about pushing certain people as they think they are more marketable. Although TV purposes / controversy are the reason for a lot of the things we all feel are manipulated, the pushing of 1 Direction and Cher particularly appears to be because Cowell wants to sign them anyway; even though he probably knew she couldn't win, Cher is obviously much more marketable as a finalist than finishing say 8th.
However, a lot of it boils down to TV ratings and votes - e.g. people will tune into to see what katie/Wagner do next or if they are finally going to go, or they will vote for others acts to 'spite' the programme. Even though the show would like certain acts to be successful post-X factor, how quickly some of these are dropped suggest that the true priorities lie in making a highly talked about and watched TV show which brings in phone votes. That is why so many of us are saying that its more like a soap opera, and i feel that cowell and co are more interested in this aspect than anything else.
I know I am not saying anything new here, just summng up what people have said for years; however this year's show has arguably shown what quite a few people feel are their true priorities more than ever before.
Cher and the judges stole Marys rightful place in the final and the truth is Cher shouldn't have got past the Judges house as she never actually performed but nowadays society seems to reward the wrong kind of people:D
How did Cher steal it by performing better in the sing off than Mary?
Cher is not more popular than Paiige and it is not spin, the facts are that Paiige was getting more of a share of the public vote each week, (His vote was growing in the end to more than Cher).
<sigh> you are either very bad at reading tables or very bad with numbers. cher was above paije in the voting every week apart from the week he went out. this means that in total cher had received more votes than paije by that time, unless on that particular week there was a surprisingly high surge in the numbers of votes cast - highly unlikely. there is no way getting around that fact so i am surprised you are still trying to.
Next year, just don't vote OR believe a single view/statement made by a judge; some of the proclaimations Cowell made about manifestly not popular acts like Waissel, Cher and to some extent 1D now look even more laughable than when he originally blurted them out.
cher was consistently in the top 5 of the voting and she came 4th. i would say cowell got it about right with regards to her popularity, her final ranking reflected her popularity very well. katie was the one who overstayed her welcome.. and one direction were massively overhyped but 4th place is a fair reflection of their popularity too.
FIX, FIX, FIX,,,,,,and SC was behind it ALL ALONG!!;);):rolleyes:
Justice for Mary/TreyC I say!!;);)
Treyc may not have been bottom the week she went, but - unlike Katie - she never bothered the top half at any time. She didn't even come close to double figures. She was dull and deserved to go.
After Cher left the remaining three acts split the vote:-
Matt 39.8%
Rebecca 37.9%
One Direction 22.3%
After One Direction were eliminated the final two split the vote:-
Matt 52.2%
Rebecca 47.8%
Just over one quarter (25.7%) of all the final week's votes were placed before Freeze 1 on Saturday, when Cher was knocked out
Just over one third (35.5%) of all the final week's votes were placed between Freeze 1 on Saturday and Freeze 2 on Sunday evening, when One Direction left
The heaviest voting period of all was when it was down to the final two, with 38.8% of all the final week's votes being given.
Two things strike me as interesting...
1. How close the vote split was between Matt and Rebecca once it came down to the final three, and then the final two
2. By far the heaviest voting (given the relatively short time period) occurred when it came down to the final two, Matt and Rebecca
In summary - if they had dragged the final out for another 30 minutes and/or Rebecca had sung her winners song first she might have won! Singing the winners song first makes a big difference when its close!
I love to see the voting stats. It makes for interesting reading this year. But for all the manipulations, the right/most popular person won in the end. None of the jiggery-pokery affected Matt's chances as he was the clear favorite and thus deserved to win.
It's a shame for the contestants who were wrongly evicted by the judges save, but the order they went out in did not impact on the final result. Paije, Aiden, Mary etc would never have won anyway.
Next year, just don't vote OR believe a single view/statement made by a judge; some of the proclaimations Cowell made about manifestly not popular acts like Waissel, Cher and to some extent 1D now look even more laughable than when he originally blurted them out.
Don't you think that this actually PROVES that the judges don't know the voting figures?
No-one can actually tell me what Simon/ITV gain by putting unpopular acts through because the answer is absolutely nothing!
Comments
Damned if you do and damned if you dont. No point in having judges vote off if they should reflect the actual votes. I think thats the next debate. Either go the way of Strictly (where judges had some say in the voting but not in the bottom 2) or dont have a say in the voting at all but still have the bottom 2 sing-off vote power. Otherwise why even bother with judges?!?
As for Matt's future, I do worry that he will get manipulated too much for his own good and will end up getting nowhere. Keeping fingers crossed that he has a big say in his direction/styling/promotion and that will give him a more Will Young type future as opposed to a Joe McElderry type future. When I heard that my 2 favourite stand out songs off the show were also on his winners CD, even I am tempted to make the purchase. And I've never bought ANYTHING as a result of the X-factor!!! I loved the way he really gave some songs new angles and styles in delivery, that was the talent aside from the top notes!
Well done Matt!
Mary had 22.28 to Matts 15.14 so Mary won week one. But apart from that, Matt was top every week.
1. If there is one thing I will applaud, that is this set of figures have clearly not been manipulated in anyway. Because it is in effect quite an incriminating document!
2. Incriminating in respect that the whole 'deadlock' scenario is now discredited. I cannot comment on Simon - it is his show. But it also seems clear to me that Dannii, Cheryl and Louis have no independence when it comes to who they are actually voting to save/eliminate. Almost every time it did not go to deadlock, the act with a bigger share of the vote went.
3. Simon has got to start treating male contestants and female contestants equally. Aside from the fawning over 1D, judges repeatedly saved female acts over male acts. Week 1 Katie over FYD (Katie had a worse vote). Week 2 Belle Amie over Diva Fever (Belle Amie had a worse vote) Week 3 Tracey over John (Tracey had a worse vote, though I accept John choked the sing-off) Week 4 , 5 and 6 girls were up against each other in a situation created by weeks 1, 2 and 3. Week 7 Cher over Paije (Cher had a worse vote)
4. One Direction were never in the race. Unlucky, Simon!
5. Matt has been ahead since week 2.
6. I thought Rebecca had blown it after the duet with Christina. Incredibly, despite Matt's sizzling hot duet with Rihanna, he actually lost a huge chunk of his lead between Saturday and Sunday halfway point. In between, Rebecca blew the roof off the building with her rendition of Sweet Dreams.
7. Wagner never polled more than 10.48% (in the week that he went out), and therefore was never in contention. So Simon's 'derailing the show' rant can be added to his list of b******s this series. The worst that happened was that we were stuck with him for longer than we would have wished.
8. Cher and Katie in particular were the net beneficiaries of every sending-home decision by the judges. This myth by some forum posters about acts like them keeping the show interesting continues to be peddled. The voting percentages show at best viewers were ambivalent about them.
9. Mary and Aiden were dropping votes nearly every week, as viewers realised neither were as good as they first thought. Mary won week one!
10. Who were the nutters who voted for Katie in week 7? It shows that when it comes down to it, viewers can be manipulated.
11. But the master cannot control everything, and at least the final is relatively untouched by judges' interference. Simon's attempts to make Matt look foolish with the sickbed video and the snide remarks about "just getting on with it" did not have the effect of a Rebecca or 1D win. Awww shame!
All Abigail showed was that you can correctly predict the outcome to a certain extent. And I said in one of those threads that I have been getting equally accurate predictions about who goes from the spoof Katie Weasel twitter. (Usually the acts she poked fun at as being the ones who should 'pack their bags' or 'we're singing the countdown theme to' were indeed the ones who went that week!)
Same of week 7 between Cher and Paije. So just 4 being fixed, the most important being the semi final.
Or perhaps week 1 when Katie should have gone
First and Second.
It appears that the protest vote was all he had. Nobody actually liked his performance. He nearly went in week one.
He impressed every week but those are the songs that sealed it for him. Quite rightly IMO. I note that they are both on the CD that is being released and which I may well buy.
I too hope that he does a 'Will Young' and can carve out his own career by being strong enough to stand up to the Syco lot. He certainly seems keen to get on and write his own stuff - good for him.
Interestingly, the last time I bought a winners single was Will Young (all those years ago) and I have bought Matt's today.
1D appear to have been a polished turd throughout... which to be frank slightly surprises me - I thought that the teeny vote was stronger than that.
I hope they learn that the public actual want singers not mingers or blingers.
Cher is not more popular than Paiige and it is not spin, the facts are that Paiige was getting more of a share of the public vote each week, (His vote was growing in the end to more than Cher).
Cher on the other hand was still only receiving the same Teeny Vote and most of those are kids voting twice or more.
Despite getting the Pimp slots a lot of the time, Cher from Week 6 onwards was polling low in the votes. and whatever way you may like it to be. The proof is there for all to see and hear. Lol. Paiige is easily the better singer and he sings very well.
As regards see who's more popular after the show ends, Cher will get pushed on the kids as she got iin to the final, albeit grossly unfairly and Paiige will get no help but even then I think both will disappear without trace within a year . Paiige has a better personality and he is a far superior singer, Cher is just shrill and vile.
Cher and the judges stole Marys rightful place in the final and the truth is Cher shouldn't have got past the Judges house as she never actually performed but nowadays society seems to reward the wrong kind of people:D
After Cher left the remaining three acts split the vote:-
Matt 39.8%
Rebecca 37.9%
One Direction 22.3%
After One Direction were eliminated the final two split the vote:-
Matt 52.2%
Rebecca 47.8%
Just over one quarter (25.7%) of all the final week's votes were placed before Freeze 1 on Saturday, when Cher was knocked out
Just over one third (35.5%) of all the final week's votes were placed between Freeze 1 on Saturday and Freeze 2 on Sunday evening, when One Direction left
The heaviest voting period of all was when it was down to the final two, with 38.8% of all the final week's votes being given.
Two things strike me as interesting...
1. How close the vote split was between Matt and Rebecca once it came down to the final three, and then the final two
2. By far the heaviest voting (given the relatively short time period) occurred when it came down to the final two, Matt and Rebecca
Next year, just don't vote OR believe a single view/statement made by a judge; some of the proclaimations Cowell made about manifestly not popular acts like Waissel, Cher and to some extent 1D now look even more laughable than when he originally blurted them out.
They seem to move the goal posts of what a good sing off performance is most of the time.
Completely agree with all of this response. I watch American idol and see some of the same tricks there, and due to the Cowell connection both shows use songs from there that they know are successful /not, as the case may be. It is fascinating to watch Cowell praise a song choice that he rubbished across the pond and so on, which adds to all of the theories about the comments being used as part of the manipulation.
I also agree about pushing certain people as they think they are more marketable. Although TV purposes / controversy are the reason for a lot of the things we all feel are manipulated, the pushing of 1 Direction and Cher particularly appears to be because Cowell wants to sign them anyway; even though he probably knew she couldn't win, Cher is obviously much more marketable as a finalist than finishing say 8th.
However, a lot of it boils down to TV ratings and votes - e.g. people will tune into to see what katie/Wagner do next or if they are finally going to go, or they will vote for others acts to 'spite' the programme. Even though the show would like certain acts to be successful post-X factor, how quickly some of these are dropped suggest that the true priorities lie in making a highly talked about and watched TV show which brings in phone votes. That is why so many of us are saying that its more like a soap opera, and i feel that cowell and co are more interested in this aspect than anything else.
I know I am not saying anything new here, just summng up what people have said for years; however this year's show has arguably shown what quite a few people feel are their true priorities more than ever before.
How did Cher steal it by performing better in the sing off than Mary?
<sigh> you are either very bad at reading tables or very bad with numbers. cher was above paije in the voting every week apart from the week he went out. this means that in total cher had received more votes than paije by that time, unless on that particular week there was a surprisingly high surge in the numbers of votes cast - highly unlikely. there is no way getting around that fact so i am surprised you are still trying to.
cher was consistently in the top 5 of the voting and she came 4th. i would say cowell got it about right with regards to her popularity, her final ranking reflected her popularity very well. katie was the one who overstayed her welcome.. and one direction were massively overhyped but 4th place is a fair reflection of their popularity too.
Treyc may not have been bottom the week she went, but - unlike Katie - she never bothered the top half at any time. She didn't even come close to double figures. She was dull and deserved to go.
In summary - if they had dragged the final out for another 30 minutes and/or Rebecca had sung her winners song first she might have won! Singing the winners song first makes a big difference when its close!
It's a shame for the contestants who were wrongly evicted by the judges save, but the order they went out in did not impact on the final result. Paije, Aiden, Mary etc would never have won anyway.
Don't you think that this actually PROVES that the judges don't know the voting figures?
No-one can actually tell me what Simon/ITV gain by putting unpopular acts through because the answer is absolutely nothing!