A PVR records to a hard drive in larger sectors which is why it doesn't need defragging. A computer writes by placing tiny files all over the disc which is why it starts to slow down when it gets full as it searches for all those files. That is why computers do need defragging.
Yes true and I'm sure we had this discussion sometime ago.
Here is a good small article that explains it very well here
I just did the forced update and got the new software but it's cleared my other channels, it deleted all my channel favourites, it changed my Scart output from RGB to PAL (lame!), my Sky+ preferences were defaulted, etc. etc.
A PVR records to a hard drive in larger sectors which is why it doesn't need defragging. A computer writes by placing tiny files all over the disc which is why it starts to slow down when it gets full as it searches for all those files. That is why computers do need defragging.
And to add to this, a PC will also have a large swap file placed on the hard drive, to act as simulated memory, the less free space you have the smaller the swap file, and therefore the lower virtual memory you have.
But for the majority of people that will never be an issue as they dont let their boxes run low on disc space.
If the user doesn't permanently delete every programme the drive space will technically become full over time, then programmes will be automatically deleted.
If the majority of users don't/won't know about undelete (your guesswork) then their hard drives will be technically filing up in the background without them knowing anyway.
For me it becomes a pain as now we have to delete programmes twice, the delete function should have an expiry date and delete automatically after a user defined period of time to stop the hard disc getting clogged up.
Why are you deleting twice?
You said a few posts ago you know nothing about hard drives, so how do you come to the conclusion your hard drive will get clogged up?
Both my 1TB boxes are technically full, it started deleting old programmes weeks ago to make space for new ones, the speed and reliability of the box has been unaffected.
Got this update Monday night and apart from them taking away another useful function we seem to have the old blue screen/delay bug back on changing channels e.t.c
Also when you stop and start playback what your watching moves on a few seconds, clearly its still playing while in the blue scren state until the channel comes back
I really wish sky would give the customers the option of not having these updates, and we certainly should not be having bugs back that were removed many months ago.:mad:
A Setup Option - No Updates
Had one hiccup the other day, went in and out, and back into the EPG quickly by being clumsy, and all the EPG content was missing. Was only resolved by flitting to HD tab and back again. Was a weird screen corruption issue.
I now have the Catchup TV tab and ITV Player, etc, but where do I find the Undelete button? And is there a website where I can find out all the ITV Regions to re-add in the other channels menu?
I now have the Catchup TV tab and ITV Player, etc, but where do I find the Undelete button? And is there a website where I can find out all the ITV Regions to re-add in the other channels menu?
Undelete is to the left of All in the Planner menu
Can anyone please advise the frequency to enter to get STV-HD in the Other Channels Menu? I've tried 10936, V, 22000, 5/6, but it's not found so it must have changed.
A Setup Option - No Updates
Had one hiccup the other day, went in and out, and back into the EPG quickly by being clumsy, and all the EPG content was missing. Was only resolved by flitting to HD tab and back again. Was a weird screen corruption issue.
That would be the best option sky could add, well allowing us a option to get back the 11 line EPG they robbed us of as well.
I have also had a simular problem to you since the new update, sometimes if I use backup out of a playback it will give me an empty planner, have to go back into the planner to get it back.
I just hope we are now finished with these darn updates for a while now.
That would be the best option sky could add, well allowing us a option to get back the 11 line EPG they robbed us of as well.
I have also had a simular problem to you since the new update, sometimes if I use backup out of a playback it will give me an empty planner, have to go back into the planner to get it back.
I just hope we are now finished with these darn updates for a while now.
Buy a Thomson HD box from ebay and you will never get any new updates and you will get the 11 lines back.
That would be the best option sky could add, well allowing us a option to get back the 11 line EPG they robbed us of as well.
I have also had a simular problem to you since the new update, sometimes if I use backup out of a playback it will give me an empty planner, have to go back into the planner to get it back.
I just hope we are now finished with these darn updates for a while now.
So you would sacrifice on demand/catchup etc and all other updates just to get 11 lines back?
Can anyone please advise the frequency to enter to get STV-HD in the Other Channels Menu? I've tried 10936, V, 22000, 5/6, but it's not found so it must have changed.
You cannot add STV HD back into other channels if it has been erased as the SR is now 23,000 with a FEC of 8/9. With it stored in other channels before the parameters were changed the box allowed you to still watch after the change.
Can anyone please advise the frequency to enter to get STV-HD in the Other Channels Menu? I've tried 10936, V, 22000, 5/6, but it's not found so it must have changed.
It's no longer available to manually tune on a sky
Bix
Not so sure you are right, will check up with the experts at my workplace on this. I dont think a PVR works any different to a computer, a hard disc is a hard disc.
I have a few laptops here, have 2 with almost same specs one is about 1/3 full the other 80%, the fuller one is certainly slower and need constant de-frag. My one with a 1/3 full (3 years old) never had to de-frag. I just think its common sense the fuller the hard drive the slower it runs.
Computers are different, as most files are spread across the hard drive, when you defrag your hard drive on your computer it moves the files closer together, for example you have Word Doc 1.doc at the start of the drive but Word Doc 2.doc at the end of the drive, so loading Word Doc 1 is quick, but Word Doc 2 takes longer as the arm has to move further across the hard drive platter to get the information required, when you defrag, the file is moved closer to all the other files hence improved performance.
It also depends on the Operating System, and most latest operating systems are designed to stop saving files in random places on the hard drive, whilst not perfect, defragmentation is required less these days than it was 10 years ago.
In terms of the Sky EPG, it would be recording a huge chunk of a file in one place, not a small byte of a file, or several bytes of a file spread all over the hard drive.
PVRs also use slightly better drives that are designed for PVR usage than normal hard drive so the drives inside the Sky Boxes are designed to be used by PVRs so they will not degrade or slow down the PVR over time like a computer hard drive would, case in point years ago when I put a standard drive in a Sky box to increase space (before 1TB boxes were available), there was a slow down in performance as I was not using a Hard Drive designed for PVR usage, I then eventually used a larger PVR designed hard drive and the performance issues were resolved.
So don't compare Computer releated fragmentation and performance over PVR performance as they are both totally different systems, and also a computer slow down, the hard drive would not only be the factor.
Which makes the whole thing pointless, as per my other post an expriry date should be included to stop hard disc clogging up. For most people its gonna result in their hard discs being practically full 24/7 which will hit performance.
Why are you having to delete things twice?
You have missed the whole point of the undelete tab. It's a list of programmes which can be recovered, for a short time, until their space on the HDD has been used again. They are already 'deleted' and count among your free disk space.
You don't have to delete them a second time: they will eventually just disappear from the undelete tab.
If you don't like the function, then don't use it. It has no detrimental impact on the your usage of a Sky STB whatsoever.
For someone who claims superior intelligence, you have a remarkable ability to misunderstand/misinterpret some fairly basic concepts. :rolleyes:
Why do I get the impression that if someone handed you a winning lotto jackpot ticket, you'd complain that they weren't your favourite numbers! :mad: :mad:
Computers are different, as most files are spread across the hard drive, when you defrag your hard drive on your computer it moves the files closer together, for example you have Word Doc 1.doc at the start of the drive but Word Doc 2.doc at the end of the drive, so loading Word Doc 1 is quick, but Word Doc 2 takes longer as the arm has to move further across the hard drive platter to get the information required, when you defrag, the file is moved closer to all the other files hence improved performance.
It also depends on the Operating System, and most latest operating systems are designed to stop saving files in random places on the hard drive, whilst not perfect, defragmentation is required less these days than it was 10 years ago.
In terms of the Sky EPG, it would be recording a huge chunk of a file in one place, not a small byte of a file, or several bytes of a file spread all over the hard drive.
PVRs also use slightly better drives that are designed for PVR usage than normal hard drive so the drives inside the Sky Boxes are designed to be used by PVRs so they will not degrade or slow down the PVR over time like a computer hard drive would, case in point years ago when I put a standard drive in a Sky box to increase space (before 1TB boxes were available), there was a slow down in performance as I was not using a Hard Drive designed for PVR usage, I then eventually used a larger PVR designed hard drive and the performance issues were resolved.
So don't compare Computer releated fragmentation and performance over PVR performance as they are both totally different systems, and also a computer slow down, the hard drive would not only be the factor.
But a hard drive be it a PVR or computer does not function at its best when completely full, and with the undelete function people who dont delete permanently will eventually be using hard discs totally full 24/7.
Comments
Yes true and I'm sure we had this discussion sometime ago.
Here is a good small article that explains it very well here
And to add to this, a PC will also have a large swap file placed on the hard drive, to act as simulated memory, the less free space you have the smaller the swap file, and therefore the lower virtual memory you have.
the Thompson boxes haven't had any updates for quite some time, and Sky actively tried to get them replaced a while back also.
call up Sky, tell them you have a Thompson box which means you can't get on-demand and see what they offer.
If the majority of users don't/won't know about undelete (your guesswork) then their hard drives will be technically filing up in the background without them knowing anyway.
Why are you deleting twice?
You said a few posts ago you know nothing about hard drives, so how do you come to the conclusion your hard drive will get clogged up?
Both my 1TB boxes are technically full, it started deleting old programmes weeks ago to make space for new ones, the speed and reliability of the box has been unaffected.
A Setup Option - No Updates
Had one hiccup the other day, went in and out, and back into the EPG quickly by being clumsy, and all the EPG content was missing. Was only resolved by flitting to HD tab and back again. Was a weird screen corruption issue.
Undelete is to the left of All in the Planner menu
That would be the best option sky could add, well allowing us a option to get back the 11 line EPG they robbed us of as well.
I have also had a simular problem to you since the new update, sometimes if I use backup out of a playback it will give me an empty planner, have to go back into the planner to get it back.
I just hope we are now finished with these darn updates for a while now.
Buy a Thomson HD box from ebay and you will never get any new updates and you will get the 11 lines back.
I loved my old thomson box, so sad when the drive failed:(
So you would sacrifice on demand/catchup etc and all other updates just to get 11 lines back?
GL won't use On Demand (Anytime+) don't forget (free wireless connector not available yet)
You cannot add STV HD back into other channels if it has been erased as the SR is now 23,000 with a FEC of 8/9. With it stored in other channels before the parameters were changed the box allowed you to still watch after the change.
It's no longer available to manually tune on a sky
Bix
She got given a free wifi connector though when the 3 engineers visited her........
Computers are different, as most files are spread across the hard drive, when you defrag your hard drive on your computer it moves the files closer together, for example you have Word Doc 1.doc at the start of the drive but Word Doc 2.doc at the end of the drive, so loading Word Doc 1 is quick, but Word Doc 2 takes longer as the arm has to move further across the hard drive platter to get the information required, when you defrag, the file is moved closer to all the other files hence improved performance.
It also depends on the Operating System, and most latest operating systems are designed to stop saving files in random places on the hard drive, whilst not perfect, defragmentation is required less these days than it was 10 years ago.
In terms of the Sky EPG, it would be recording a huge chunk of a file in one place, not a small byte of a file, or several bytes of a file spread all over the hard drive.
PVRs also use slightly better drives that are designed for PVR usage than normal hard drive so the drives inside the Sky Boxes are designed to be used by PVRs so they will not degrade or slow down the PVR over time like a computer hard drive would, case in point years ago when I put a standard drive in a Sky box to increase space (before 1TB boxes were available), there was a slow down in performance as I was not using a Hard Drive designed for PVR usage, I then eventually used a larger PVR designed hard drive and the performance issues were resolved.
So don't compare Computer releated fragmentation and performance over PVR performance as they are both totally different systems, and also a computer slow down, the hard drive would not only be the factor.
You have missed the whole point of the undelete tab. It's a list of programmes which can be recovered, for a short time, until their space on the HDD has been used again. They are already 'deleted' and count among your free disk space.
You don't have to delete them a second time: they will eventually just disappear from the undelete tab.
If you don't like the function, then don't use it. It has no detrimental impact on the your usage of a Sky STB whatsoever.
For someone who claims superior intelligence, you have a remarkable ability to misunderstand/misinterpret some fairly basic concepts. :rolleyes:
Why do I get the impression that if someone handed you a winning lotto jackpot ticket, you'd complain that they weren't your favourite numbers! :mad: :mad:
don't worry, she has her "experts" at work she can run things past first
on a totally unrelated note - the sesame street word of the day is delusional.
Never actually thought of doing that! I'll give Sky a bell when I get home - thank you
But a hard drive be it a PVR or computer does not function at its best when completely full, and with the undelete function people who dont delete permanently will eventually be using hard discs totally full 24/7.