TBH, I'd always insist on any kind of optional restriction being lifted, regardless of what it was or whether it matters to me.
Crap like this only retains it's effect if people can be embarrassed or ashamed about it.
If 30 million people all insist on the same thing, there's nothing for anybody to be embarrassed or ashamed about.
I can't help thinking that the people who'll be doing most of the raging about this are the pimply teenagers who're worried their bill-paying parents won't be removing the block.
Those teenagers will have to get their porn via torrents and it will cause minutes of untold frustration, thus making any such legislation well worth the effort, complication, money and manpower.
The greater worry is that so far this government has asked ISPs to unplug TPB and they've complied, asked ISPs to unplug porn and it seems they'll comply.
You've got to wonder how long it'll be before they ask them to unplug "subversive" websites such as wikileaks and prisonplanet etc too.
Interesting to see how they'd deal with sites that have porn but where porn isn't the main purpose. Would 4chan get the chop? Would gif maker sites that allow hardcore images in the gifs?
If they try to block 4chan there's gonna be fun and games, and presumably an endless battle to keep it blocked the ISP's will lose.
Simulated raped to be banned? So no drama, no film, no tv show can ever show a rape scene? But you can show a murder scene? What a load of stupid crap. Completely unenforceable. But of course very handy for the police. Search your pc, find nothing, but find you watched a video of some rough sex once. Conviction obtained.
If people want to get off to pretend rape then that's there business. It's not rape, because the participants are actors.
And actually, there's no harm in kids seeing porn. Anyone under 30 has grown up seeing internet porn from an early age. 99% of us are perfectly decent people. We didn't have our childhoods 'corrupted', or 'ruined'. We didn't lose our 'innocence'.
I've never been entitrely clear what it is about sex that 'corrupts' people anyway. Its a normal, healthy activity. There's nothing sinful about it. Let the kids see it. It'll probably put them off for a bit anyway.
Simulated raped to be banned? So no drama, no film, no tv show can ever show a rape scene? But you can show a murder scene? What a load of stupid crap. Completely unenforceable. But of course very handy for the police. Search your pc, find nothing, but find you watched a video of some rough sex once. Conviction obtained.
If people want to get off to pretend rape then that's there business. It's not rape, because the participants are actors.
And actually, there's no harm in kids seeing porn. Anyone under 30 has grown up seeing internet porn from an early age. 99% of us are perfectly decent people. We didn't have our childhoods 'corrupted', or 'ruined'. We didn't lose our 'innocence'.
I've never been entitrely clear what it is about sex that 'corrupts' people anyway. Its a normal, healthy activity. There's nothing sinful about it. Let the kids see it. It'll probably put them off for a bit anyway.
The other day, I was having a debate with someone about the asian grooming gangs. They claimed that no asian girls were involved, so in an attempt to refute that I googled "asian girl raped."
It strikes me now under these plans that that search would be banned.
They are desperate to control the internet, that is all this is. Snowden has already let the cat out of the bag that they are recording everything we do online.
It's like trying to hold back a tidal wave. Cameron is the little boy with his finger in the dyke. (But hang on, we're back to porn again )
Its party that the task is enormous and exists in so many places that you can't possibly keep up to date with whats out there. Partly that there's no way to stop anyone going anywhere unless you make all sorts of things that internet savvy people do impossible and illegal. And its partly that the blocking software can't ever tell the difference between different meanings of words (as in your post above) or cope with stories about male prisoners in Syria being raped, or Iranian gays hung from cranes. In the worst cases of filtering you find pictures of anyone in a bikini, and any coverage of violence, combat or sex crimes, just vanishes.
They are always ways around it they are ways around everything if the kid can't figure out themselves a quick google search will show them.
That's why I don't see why people are bothered about this as it won't stop anybody all you need is a proxy and it will bypass any block that's why the block on torrents in the UK has not worked.
If your child proves untrustworthy and abuses their privileges, take them away.
Seriously, when did this become such an abstract concept?
Your child disobeys you, punish them by removing their luxuries, taking away their technology and limiting their options to the kind that are acceptable.
As for children being some sort of tech savants, I think you are greatly overestimating the patience and intellects of most minors. Kids are still kids and if anything the fact we're adjusting education standards so drastically to accomodate their apparent lowering of capabilities by creating a brand new grading system and exams actually disproves that theory. What worked for decades and generations is being changed because Little Timmy can't answer an exam question or be bothered to study because he can take a photo on his smartphone, ask for a toilet break and google all the answers.
If your kid cannot be trusted to not try hack the software you have installed, then simply cut off their wifi access, password protect it from allowing them to change the settings, install Encarta on their laptop so they have access to all the knowledge they might need, just not any open internet access or search engines.
As I said, all these things can be done with sufficient instructions and research or by an IT professional if you pay them for their services.
Just because a disobedient child and an irresponsible parent have a crap relationship with no trust doesn't mean I shouldn't be able to access adult material myself.
What next, do we start putting clothes on nude sculptures like that episode of the Simpsons where Michelangelo's David comes to be displayed in the town or smashing their genitals off like they did in the Dark Ages?
This is dictatorial prohibitive nonsense concocted by delusional and overentitled bullies who think everyone has to live the way they do because apparently individual rights and personal responsibility are too difficult for us, the stupid masses who can't control how much we drink, what entertainment we consume or how much we eat which is complete crap. People need to be forced to take accountability for their behaviour and responsibility for themselves and their children.
This kind of heavy handed crap is basically the government saying "We can't trust you so we'll take care of the stuff you're too stupid to control for yourself" which is frankly insulting to those of us who don't weight 22st and have kids going out looking to rob elderly people before kicking them to death because they have no concept of consequence because mum was too busy eating biscuits and arguing with her boyfriend to teach them any values or manners. "Well what am I supposed to do?" If people have to ask that, they shouldn't have tried to be responsible for things they are apparently too stupid to understand but those of us who aren't craven morons too lazy to think or act shouldn't have to suffer the consequences with them, they should suffer them personally and be forced to learn from their mistakes or have their responsibilities taken away given over to someone not completely useless, not be given the option of blaming others or forcing others rights or options to be taken away as well.
Anyone else going to call their ISP for porn?
I am, otherwise there is one less things to do on the internet!
ISP (answering phone): Sky wánkers unblocking line here - how can I help you? User (hesitantly): Er, I'd like some porn unblocked please. ISP: Certainly, sir! Was it mild stuff you were looking for, or something harder? User: Erm.... ISP: There's some really good Golden Shower material out there at the moment... Or if that's not to sir's fancy, I can connect you to some really decent bukkake stuff? Can't unblock you for any fisting, though - you'll need to fill in form 26FU for that and get it countersigned by Mr Cameron.
I await "woman raped in public park" being censored on the BBC website or better yet, rape cases not even being published on the internet just in case someone might find it a turn on. Let's just blame the woman for wearing a bikini rather than spiked armour and the man for just not understanding that rape is not okay because he's obviously too stupid to realise a screaming woman he doesn't know trying to push him off is not an open invitation to have sex. We're all just idiots, after all. Unless Boris Johnson or David Cameron don't pull him off and give him a damn good talking to, how is that rapist meant to know he's in the wrong?
Hell, while we're at it, let's just censor everything that could possibly be bad or dangerous.
No more disposable lighters, barbecues or blowtorches in case people become pyromaniacs.
No more knives, chainsaws, chains, barbed wire or department stores just in case someone goes to buy some new decking and is inspired to become a serial killer who locks up and tortures their victims.
Let's not sell any pets to anyone and have all of them seized and destroyed so they can never suffer any animal cruelty ever again.
Let's just blot out the sun in case someone develops skin cancer too. We've got light bulb and torches after all.
After all, we can't expect people to just use things responsibly or take precautions for their own safety and those around them. Everyone not in government is just a gibbering idiot who needs to have their options taken away.
We are the laughing stock of the world. Again. First it was arresting people who posted their opinions on Twitter and now we have huge censorship of every adult's life because of moral panic and hysteria. Conservatives OUT
We are the laughing stock of the world. Again. First it was arresting people who posted their opinions on Twitter and now we have huge censorship of every adult's life because of moral panic and hysteria. Conservatives OUT
Let's not forget the pasty tax, the ID card system that would have meant a hand and eye transplant if you lost your own card, the plain packaged cigarette idea that's been trashed...
Seriously, we didn't even elect these people as a majority. Who the Hell are they to think they can speak for the masses when they didn't even get a clear and decisive sanction by us as a democracy to do any of this?
And on top of this, they want a pay rise? They want to be rewarded for taking away public services and facilities, takin away civil liberties and personal choice, cutting the upper tax rate so the rich retain more while cutting benefits so those with the least have even less, taking power away from actual medical authorities and putting them in the hands of GPs who don't have the same specified knowledge... even though these guys get a summer holiday while others must work? We already pay for a CCTV network we don't need and can't even afford to keep running efficiently because we have more cameras that any other 2 EU countries combined.
We can afford £950 million in foreign aid but can't keep maternity and cancer wards open?
It's like Spitting Image and Monty Python characters are being born into reality and somehow all of them are becoming MPs.
Well, if he's one of their old sports or senior alums from the Bullingdon Club, that might just be one of their rituals of recognition they have before they go to the nearest family run restaurant to eat before vandalising the place and throwing money in the face of the owners.
Censorship intensifies. Anyone who's in favour of this needs a kick in the teeth.
Don't want your kids looking at porn? Then don't let them have computers in the bedroom. David Cameron isn't their stepfather. Learn to be a bloody parent.
I absolutely despise the way this country is heading.
Absolutely this^^^^^. my computer is heavily policed and i know what is being seen on it.
i would never leave my children to be babysat for hours on end by anything you plug into a wall.
ISP (answering phone): Sky wánkers unblocking line here - how can I help you? User (hesitantly): Er, I'd like some porn unblocked please. ISP: Certainly, sir! Was it mild stuff you were looking for, or something harder? User: Erm.... ISP: There's some really good Golden Shower material out there at the moment... Or if that's not to sir's fancy, I can connect you to some really decent bukkake stuff? Can't unblock you for any fisting, though - you'll need to fill in form 26FU for that and get it countersigned by Mr Cameron.
I can't see a problem with users having to ask to opt in. If they want it, they have to ask for it.
I shouldn't have to ask for what hasn't been agreed by the majority in a supposed democracy.
You don't seem to understand the oppressive nature of such a unilateral ruling robbing people of basic personal rights to choose what they want when they want it.
How long before we have to declare everything we want and fill out a form before we get it?
"Want to buy some condoms? Please tell me where you will use them, who you will use them with, on what regularity will you use them and what acts you will use them for? Also I need your credit card details, home address and also your partner or partners as well. Can't be letting you run about being promiscuous popping out babies and trying to scam child benefits, can I? Condom use must be regulated for your own good and to ensure you're doing the kind of things this government approves of."
I think your screen name is clearly ironic if you can't grasp that basic idea that this is capitalist democracy where we vote with our wallets and our ballots for what we want. This is not meant to be a dictatorship where one man can tell everyone else what to do because he thinks it's okay.
I shouldn't have to ask for what hasn't been agreed by the majority in a supposed democracy.
You don't seem to understand the oppressive nature of such a unilateral ruling robbing people of basic personal rights to choose what they want when they want it.
How long before we have to declare everything we want and fill out a form before we get it?
"Want to buy some condoms? Please tell me where you will use them, who you will use them with, on what regularity will you use them and what acts you will use them for? Also I need your credit card details, home address and also your partner or partners as well. Can't be letting you run about being promiscuous popping out babies and trying to scam child benefits, can I?"
I think your screen name is clearly ironic if you can't grasp that basic idea that this is capitalist democracy where we vote with our wallets and our ballots for what we want. This is not meant to be a dictatorship where one man can tell everyone else what to do because he thinks it's okay.
Society evolves. If you'd said 10 years ago that people would be controlled on where they could smoke - a perfectly legal activity - you would have laughed. But here we are, we are controlled not because of what WE do, but because of the harm those activities can inflict on others.
No child of mine needs to see porn, so making it an opt in system doesn't prevent those who want to see it, and it makes life a lot easier for those who don't want their family accessing it.
Society evolves. If you'd said 10 years ago that people would be controlled on where they could smoke - a perfectly legal activity - you would have laughed. But here we are, we are controlled not because of what WE do, but because of the harm those activities can inflict on others.
No child of mine needs to see porn, so making it an opt in system doesn't prevent those who want to see it, and it makes life a lot easier for those who don't want their family accessing it.
I hope the same thing comes in for phones.
If you don't want your child to see porn then it is up to you as their parent to make sure they don't, not up to everyone else. Try being a parent for a change instead of expecting everyone else to be responsible for bringing up your child.
The major difference with smoking is that you're talking about a public space. In terms of the Internet we are talking about what we can do in private. Unless Dave is going to ban all porn then looking it up on the Internet is still legal and shouldn't be curtailed.
Comments
It does seem to very much be a ruling against men in general, one that could well lead to the criminalisation of many men.
Crap like this only retains it's effect if people can be embarrassed or ashamed about it.
If 30 million people all insist on the same thing, there's nothing for anybody to be embarrassed or ashamed about.
I can't help thinking that the people who'll be doing most of the raging about this are the pimply teenagers who're worried their bill-paying parents won't be removing the block.
Those teenagers will have to get their porn via torrents and it will cause minutes of untold frustration, thus making any such legislation well worth the effort, complication, money and manpower.
The greater worry is that so far this government has asked ISPs to unplug TPB and they've complied, asked ISPs to unplug porn and it seems they'll comply.
You've got to wonder how long it'll be before they ask them to unplug "subversive" websites such as wikileaks and prisonplanet etc too.
If they try to block 4chan there's gonna be fun and games, and presumably an endless battle to keep it blocked the ISP's will lose.
I certainly won't be voting Tory any time soon if they persist with this censorship
Simulated raped to be banned? So no drama, no film, no tv show can ever show a rape scene? But you can show a murder scene? What a load of stupid crap. Completely unenforceable. But of course very handy for the police. Search your pc, find nothing, but find you watched a video of some rough sex once. Conviction obtained.
If people want to get off to pretend rape then that's there business. It's not rape, because the participants are actors.
And actually, there's no harm in kids seeing porn. Anyone under 30 has grown up seeing internet porn from an early age. 99% of us are perfectly decent people. We didn't have our childhoods 'corrupted', or 'ruined'. We didn't lose our 'innocence'.
I've never been entitrely clear what it is about sex that 'corrupts' people anyway. Its a normal, healthy activity. There's nothing sinful about it. Let the kids see it. It'll probably put them off for a bit anyway.
The other day, I was having a debate with someone about the asian grooming gangs. They claimed that no asian girls were involved, so in an attempt to refute that I googled "asian girl raped."
It strikes me now under these plans that that search would be banned.
They are desperate to control the internet, that is all this is. Snowden has already let the cat out of the bag that they are recording everything we do online.
Its party that the task is enormous and exists in so many places that you can't possibly keep up to date with whats out there. Partly that there's no way to stop anyone going anywhere unless you make all sorts of things that internet savvy people do impossible and illegal. And its partly that the blocking software can't ever tell the difference between different meanings of words (as in your post above) or cope with stories about male prisoners in Syria being raped, or Iranian gays hung from cranes. In the worst cases of filtering you find pictures of anyone in a bikini, and any coverage of violence, combat or sex crimes, just vanishes.
If your child proves untrustworthy and abuses their privileges, take them away.
Seriously, when did this become such an abstract concept?
Your child disobeys you, punish them by removing their luxuries, taking away their technology and limiting their options to the kind that are acceptable.
As for children being some sort of tech savants, I think you are greatly overestimating the patience and intellects of most minors. Kids are still kids and if anything the fact we're adjusting education standards so drastically to accomodate their apparent lowering of capabilities by creating a brand new grading system and exams actually disproves that theory. What worked for decades and generations is being changed because Little Timmy can't answer an exam question or be bothered to study because he can take a photo on his smartphone, ask for a toilet break and google all the answers.
If your kid cannot be trusted to not try hack the software you have installed, then simply cut off their wifi access, password protect it from allowing them to change the settings, install Encarta on their laptop so they have access to all the knowledge they might need, just not any open internet access or search engines.
As I said, all these things can be done with sufficient instructions and research or by an IT professional if you pay them for their services.
Just because a disobedient child and an irresponsible parent have a crap relationship with no trust doesn't mean I shouldn't be able to access adult material myself.
What next, do we start putting clothes on nude sculptures like that episode of the Simpsons where Michelangelo's David comes to be displayed in the town or smashing their genitals off like they did in the Dark Ages?
This is dictatorial prohibitive nonsense concocted by delusional and overentitled bullies who think everyone has to live the way they do because apparently individual rights and personal responsibility are too difficult for us, the stupid masses who can't control how much we drink, what entertainment we consume or how much we eat which is complete crap. People need to be forced to take accountability for their behaviour and responsibility for themselves and their children.
This kind of heavy handed crap is basically the government saying "We can't trust you so we'll take care of the stuff you're too stupid to control for yourself" which is frankly insulting to those of us who don't weight 22st and have kids going out looking to rob elderly people before kicking them to death because they have no concept of consequence because mum was too busy eating biscuits and arguing with her boyfriend to teach them any values or manners. "Well what am I supposed to do?" If people have to ask that, they shouldn't have tried to be responsible for things they are apparently too stupid to understand but those of us who aren't craven morons too lazy to think or act shouldn't have to suffer the consequences with them, they should suffer them personally and be forced to learn from their mistakes or have their responsibilities taken away given over to someone not completely useless, not be given the option of blaming others or forcing others rights or options to be taken away as well.
ISP (answering phone): Sky wánkers unblocking line here - how can I help you?
User (hesitantly): Er, I'd like some porn unblocked please.
ISP: Certainly, sir! Was it mild stuff you were looking for, or something harder?
User: Erm....
ISP: There's some really good Golden Shower material out there at the moment... Or if that's not to sir's fancy, I can connect you to some really decent bukkake stuff? Can't unblock you for any fisting, though - you'll need to fill in form 26FU for that and get it countersigned by Mr Cameron.
Hell, while we're at it, let's just censor everything that could possibly be bad or dangerous.
No more disposable lighters, barbecues or blowtorches in case people become pyromaniacs.
No more knives, chainsaws, chains, barbed wire or department stores just in case someone goes to buy some new decking and is inspired to become a serial killer who locks up and tortures their victims.
Let's not sell any pets to anyone and have all of them seized and destroyed so they can never suffer any animal cruelty ever again.
Let's just blot out the sun in case someone develops skin cancer too. We've got light bulb and torches after all.
After all, we can't expect people to just use things responsibly or take precautions for their own safety and those around them. Everyone not in government is just a gibbering idiot who needs to have their options taken away.
Ahem.
Let's not forget the pasty tax, the ID card system that would have meant a hand and eye transplant if you lost your own card, the plain packaged cigarette idea that's been trashed...
Seriously, we didn't even elect these people as a majority. Who the Hell are they to think they can speak for the masses when they didn't even get a clear and decisive sanction by us as a democracy to do any of this?
And on top of this, they want a pay rise? They want to be rewarded for taking away public services and facilities, takin away civil liberties and personal choice, cutting the upper tax rate so the rich retain more while cutting benefits so those with the least have even less, taking power away from actual medical authorities and putting them in the hands of GPs who don't have the same specified knowledge... even though these guys get a summer holiday while others must work? We already pay for a CCTV network we don't need and can't even afford to keep running efficiently because we have more cameras that any other 2 EU countries combined.
We can afford £950 million in foreign aid but can't keep maternity and cancer wards open?
It's like Spitting Image and Monty Python characters are being born into reality and somehow all of them are becoming MPs.
Well, if he's one of their old sports or senior alums from the Bullingdon Club, that might just be one of their rituals of recognition they have before they go to the nearest family run restaurant to eat before vandalising the place and throwing money in the face of the owners.
Absolutely this^^^^^. my computer is heavily policed and i know what is being seen on it.
i would never leave my children to be babysat for hours on end by anything you plug into a wall.
Gianna Michaels or Jada Fire?
I shouldn't have to ask for what hasn't been agreed by the majority in a supposed democracy.
You don't seem to understand the oppressive nature of such a unilateral ruling robbing people of basic personal rights to choose what they want when they want it.
How long before we have to declare everything we want and fill out a form before we get it?
"Want to buy some condoms? Please tell me where you will use them, who you will use them with, on what regularity will you use them and what acts you will use them for? Also I need your credit card details, home address and also your partner or partners as well. Can't be letting you run about being promiscuous popping out babies and trying to scam child benefits, can I? Condom use must be regulated for your own good and to ensure you're doing the kind of things this government approves of."
I think your screen name is clearly ironic if you can't grasp that basic idea that this is capitalist democracy where we vote with our wallets and our ballots for what we want. This is not meant to be a dictatorship where one man can tell everyone else what to do because he thinks it's okay.
Society evolves. If you'd said 10 years ago that people would be controlled on where they could smoke - a perfectly legal activity - you would have laughed. But here we are, we are controlled not because of what WE do, but because of the harm those activities can inflict on others.
No child of mine needs to see porn, so making it an opt in system doesn't prevent those who want to see it, and it makes life a lot easier for those who don't want their family accessing it.
I hope the same thing comes in for phones.
If you don't want your child to see porn then it is up to you as their parent to make sure they don't, not up to everyone else. Try being a parent for a change instead of expecting everyone else to be responsible for bringing up your child.
The major difference with smoking is that you're talking about a public space. In terms of the Internet we are talking about what we can do in private. Unless Dave is going to ban all porn then looking it up on the Internet is still legal and shouldn't be curtailed.