Yesterday the Bbc's defence 'expert' reckoned the launch site could be found from it's UV signature. Normally launches are detected by the IR/heat bloom..
A lot of the time the news relies on wiki or finding someone, any one who'll give'em a quote. What they may have done is just found this-
which is the old SA-6 Kub. That used TELs linked to a seperate radar vehicle (again with IFF capability) and also in the Ukrainian inventory. But the images found and show have been for the SA-11 variant with integrated radar.
OK.
Unlike you I'm not an expert in missile technology, so was listening to those guests on the news channels, that's all.
I'm not going to spend hours and hours reading up on such weaponry either though, in some internet game of one-upmanship.
But I'd also say we still don't have any confirmation of which model or system it was. We have a couple of ideas as to what it could be and more than likely is, but that's all at present.
That's them financially finished then if everyone cancels. Flights to Australia just about to get a fair bit more expensive.
Bar Singapore airlines Malaysian airlines have always been relatively expensive - you normally get better deals with the middle Eastern airlines, KLM/Air France and Lufthansa although the service isn't as good.
I am travelling to Kuala Lumpur in the autumn - my airline requires full address and passport details before you can check in. It's pretty standard practice now for long haul.
Yeah that's what I would expect, so I don't understand why they don't know who all the passengers are straight away. I heard something about them not knowing because they were 'in transit', not sure what that means though.
A woman who lost her brother and sister-in-law in the disappearance of Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 has discovered her stepdaughter was on the plane shot down over Ukraine.
Yeah that's what I would expect, so I don't understand why they don't know who all the passengers are straight away. I heard something about them not knowing because they were 'in transit', not sure what that means though.
Its connecting flights you check in on first plane they issue everything there even give boarding cards for next flight. So when you get to next plane you don't need to check in as you did it for the first plane. So they have to go back to first time you checked in.
I did a flight like this to usa with a change in Philly. Once off the first plane you just go straight to gate hand in boarding card and your done. But at Manchester it was a case of all passport, luggage checks etc.
Today's flight MH17 has taken a circuitous route across Germany, Czech, Slovakia, Hungary, Romania, southern Black Sea coastline, NE Turkey, all over the place really and quite twisty for an airliner. flightradar24.com.
Looks like they are carefully avoiding all possible war zones including Syria and Iraq. I can't see how they can avoid Afghanistan though.
Ukraine east of Kiev is totally devoid of aircraft today.
Have they changed the number of the flight yet? Can't imagine how weird it must feel being on that flight today...
Because the safe height would have been beyond the capability of the aircraft to fly at. The only safe area was away from a nutter with the means to shoot you down. With a mobile system like this it could have been anywhere.
The 'safe' height was 24000ft plus a margin of 30% = 32000ft which they were above.
The 'safe' height turned out to be wrong but we only know that with hindsight.
I was questioning why the airline were irresponsible for flying above the published safe height.
A woman who lost her brother and sister-in-law in the disappearance of Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 has discovered her stepdaughter was on the plane shot down over Ukraine.
How awful. The odds of that happening must have incredibly low...
I think the saddest story I've heard is of two parents who lost all of their three children, aged 8, 10 and 12, on the flight (they were travelling with their grandfather). I can't even begin to imagine the pain they are going through now...:(
I watched a LOT of it last night. It was so biased (they spent most of their airtime moaning about how everyone was blaming them ie Putin) it was practically a comedy. Their anchors are abysmal as well and WTF were they thinking with that orange desk?!?!?
Unfortunately this story just goes to show what happens when East European peasants get their hands on 21st century technology. No-one's remotely interested in their petty little squabbles or their inane yearnings to be part of Russia.
Of course last night I was told RT is for people with "open minds", and that the BBC is just as biased. Not that I realised the BBC was run by the government's propaganda arm, which RT is, but there you go...
The 'safe' height was 24000ft plus a margin of 30% = 32000ft which they were above.
The 'safe' height turned out to be wrong but we only know that with hindsight.
I was questioning why the airline were irresponsible for flying above the published safe height.
Last week the 'safe' height was 26,000 feet. Monday, an An-26 was shot down at 21,000 feet and restrictions raised to 32,000 feet. Yesterday, the pilot requested clearance to 35,000 feet and was told to maintain 33,000 feet. Today, the Ukrainian SBU seized the air traffic control recordings.
Why, knowing the seperatists had high-altitude SAMs operating in that area didn't the Ukrainian government close that airspace completely?
289 innocent people were murdered on MH17. I wonder how much this govt will care about the nine who came from this country and seek strongest justice possible. We should cut off off all relations with russia and ukraine and expel their ambassadors. It may be over the top to some who favour appeasement to russia but this was an act of MURDER and can NOT go by unpunished. It is total BS to suggest it was an accident
289 innocent people were murdered on MH17. I wonder how much this govt will care about the nine who came from this country and seek strongest justice possible. We should cut off off all relations with russia and ukraine and expel their ambassadors. It may be over the top to some who favour appeasement to russia but this was an act of MURDER and can NOT go by unpunished. It is total BS to suggest it was an accident
3rd July 1988 USS Vincennes shot down Iran Air 655 killing 290 in a case of mistaken identity. It eventually paid compensation but to this day denies responsibility. Sadly accidents happen in war time.
Bigger accidents happen if politicians are allowed to exploit tragedies like this.
Being broadcast on BBC News 24. A 100% tirade against what Ukraine is doing against the rebels as if that justifies what happened.
Perhaps he has a point? So you're a seperatist. You are being bombed and shelled by the Ukrainian army. How would you defend yourself against airstrikes?
The only sensible comments coming out of this mess are ones calling for serious peace negotiations. Previous peace offers from the Ukrainian government have been little more than calls for surrender. We seem to be agreeing-
15:32: Nick Bryant BBC News, New York
The British ambassador to the UN had very strong words of condemnation, not just about what happened with the downing of the plane but for the kind of support Russia has reportedly been giving separatists in Ukraine. He said the UN Security Council had to go further than its press statement and demand separatists lay down their arms.
Comments
OK.
Unlike you I'm not an expert in missile technology, so was listening to those guests on the news channels, that's all.
I'm not going to spend hours and hours reading up on such weaponry either though, in some internet game of one-upmanship.
But I'd also say we still don't have any confirmation of which model or system it was. We have a couple of ideas as to what it could be and more than likely is, but that's all at present.
Bar Singapore airlines Malaysian airlines have always been relatively expensive - you normally get better deals with the middle Eastern airlines, KLM/Air France and Lufthansa although the service isn't as good.
Yeah that's what I would expect, so I don't understand why they don't know who all the passengers are straight away. I heard something about them not knowing because they were 'in transit', not sure what that means though.
LINK
How sad
Its connecting flights you check in on first plane they issue everything there even give boarding cards for next flight. So when you get to next plane you don't need to check in as you did it for the first plane. So they have to go back to first time you checked in.
I did a flight like this to usa with a change in Philly. Once off the first plane you just go straight to gate hand in boarding card and your done. But at Manchester it was a case of all passport, luggage checks etc.
Have they changed the number of the flight yet? Can't imagine how weird it must feel being on that flight today...
Good God that's depressing.
Game of Thrones has a lot to answer for.
The 'safe' height was 24000ft plus a margin of 30% = 32000ft which they were above.
The 'safe' height turned out to be wrong but we only know that with hindsight.
I was questioning why the airline were irresponsible for flying above the published safe height.
How awful. The odds of that happening must have incredibly low...
I think the saddest story I've heard is of two parents who lost all of their three children, aged 8, 10 and 12, on the flight (they were travelling with their grandfather). I can't even begin to imagine the pain they are going through now...:(
I watched a LOT of it last night. It was so biased (they spent most of their airtime moaning about how everyone was blaming them ie Putin) it was practically a comedy. Their anchors are abysmal as well and WTF were they thinking with that orange desk?!?!?
Some nice nighttime shots of Moscow though!
Good for her! RT is a joke.
Unfortunately this story just goes to show what happens when East European peasants get their hands on 21st century technology. No-one's remotely interested in their petty little squabbles or their inane yearnings to be part of Russia.
I was just about to post this too. A bit more detail on her issues with their idea of 'broadcasting' here.
They're incontinent too?
Last week the 'safe' height was 26,000 feet. Monday, an An-26 was shot down at 21,000 feet and restrictions raised to 32,000 feet. Yesterday, the pilot requested clearance to 35,000 feet and was told to maintain 33,000 feet. Today, the Ukrainian SBU seized the air traffic control recordings.
Why, knowing the seperatists had high-altitude SAMs operating in that area didn't the Ukrainian government close that airspace completely?
Being broadcast on BBC News 24. A 100% tirade against what Ukraine is doing against the rebels as if that justifies what happened.
No, the flight number is still in use, though I am sure it will soon be retired.
Find somewhere else to buy the proportion, which comes from Russia, of our winter fuel gas from then maybe we'll think about it.
3rd July 1988 USS Vincennes shot down Iran Air 655 killing 290 in a case of mistaken identity. It eventually paid compensation but to this day denies responsibility. Sadly accidents happen in war time.
Bigger accidents happen if politicians are allowed to exploit tragedies like this.
Perhaps he has a point? So you're a seperatist. You are being bombed and shelled by the Ukrainian army. How would you defend yourself against airstrikes?
The only sensible comments coming out of this mess are ones calling for serious peace negotiations. Previous peace offers from the Ukrainian government have been little more than calls for surrender. We seem to be agreeing-
15:32: Nick Bryant BBC News, New York
The British ambassador to the UN had very strong words of condemnation, not just about what happened with the downing of the plane but for the kind of support Russia has reportedly been giving separatists in Ukraine. He said the UN Security Council had to go further than its press statement and demand separatists lay down their arms.