Nope. The SNP have said they would not vote on non Scottish matters in the past. You can't just pick and choose a reason to break that promise when it suits.
I don't have a strong view either way on hunting with foxes. But I can smell the scent of hypocrisy.
The only hypocrisy is coming from the Tories who are trying to deceitfully reintroduce full fox hunting by the back door. Furthermore, nationwide British animal welfare charities have lobbied MPs over this issue and that includes all the SNP MPs too. The SNP MPs are therefore responding in a principled way to stop the back door reintroduction of a savage and barbarian activity:
I would think the SNP would secretly support reintroducing fox hunting in England and Wales, with the idea that it would lead to the extinction of foxes in England and Wales and them becoming a tourist attraction in Scotland
The only hypocrisy is coming from the Tories who are trying to deceitfully reintroduce full fox hunting by the back door. Furthermore, nationwide British animal welfare charities have lobbied MPs over this issue and that includes all the SNP MPs too. The SNP MPs are therefore responding in a principled way to stop the back door reintroduction of a savage and barbarian activity:
Get your facts right - the SNP is actually considering tightening up the legislation that applies in Scotland.
Well I hope you are right. I hope that this is voted down on Wednesday but it's a bit rich if the SNP vote against it and leave the law the same in Scotland. I wouldn't trust them as far as I could throw them though.
"Robertson indicated the SNP was not in a mood to be accommodating towards the Conservatives given its unhappiness with the devolution settlement offered in the Scotland bill."
"“We are in a situation where the Tory government are refusing to agree to any amendments to improve the Scotland bill – which are supported by 58 of Scotland’s 59 MPs – and imposing English votes for English laws to make Scotland’s representation at Westminster second class,” he said.
“In these circumstances, it is right and proper that we assert the Scottish interest on foxhunting by voting with Labour against the Tories’ proposals to relax the ban – in the process, reminding an arrogant UK government of just how slender their majority is – just as we will vote against the Tory welfare cuts next week and appeal to Labour to join us.”"
Well I hope you are right. I hope that this is voted down on Wednesday but it's a bit rich if the SNP vote against it and leave the law the same in Scotland. I wouldn't trust them as far as I could throw them though.
This is what the toff Tory lovers of fox hunting want to bring back on Wednesday:
"Clifford, of Newport, South Wales, told of one truly horrendous moment when hounds pulled a pregnant fox from her den and ripped it apart. Afterwards, the hunt master put the heel of his boot on the three squirming pups that had been inside her and crushed them." http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/former-fox-hunter-exposes-full-6054986
This is what the toff Tory lovers of fox hunting want to bring back on Wednesday:
"Clifford, of Newport, South Wales, told of one truly horrendous moment when hounds pulled a pregnant fox from her den and ripped it apart. Afterwards, the hunt master put the heel of his boot on the three squirming pups that had been inside her and crushed them." http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/former-fox-hunter-exposes-full-6054986
Well Im a tory voter and not a toff by any manner of means but I certainly wouldnt be backing them on this one. I think my local Tory MP is voting against it and I hope that alot of other Tory MPs do the same.
This is what the toff Tory lovers of fox hunting want to bring back on Wednesday:
"Clifford, of Newport, South Wales, told of one truly horrendous moment when hounds pulled a pregnant fox from her den and ripped it apart. Afterwards, the hunt master put the heel of his boot on the three squirming pups that had been inside her and crushed them." http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/former-fox-hunter-exposes-full-6054986
How many times are you going to use the Tory toff ad hominem on these fox threads?
I would always rather they did they right, decent, moral, humane thing and let the chips fall where they may. Especially on something as disgusting as fox hunting. Sitting it out for tactical advantage would have been amoral and that's not the party I support.
If EVEL is imposed out of spite, so bet it. Let's cross that bridge when we come to it.
If you are truly ashamed of the SNP for voting on this important issue in this current political climate you should send back your membership card.
I don't mind if the SNP vote on non Scottish matters but it just seems strange to me that they would vote to deny England parity with Scotland on Fox Hunting.
If anything I would have thought they would vote for the amendment. It seems a very strange thing to do and simply comes across as deliberately voting on an issue that won't affect Scotland just to agitate.
However, it does fall within the narrative of creating discourse between Scotland and England leading to Scottish independence and so I can see the tactics here.
Nobody will buy that anyway. And the Scottish law is itself to be looked at.
Exactly!!!
The Scottish Government want stronger anti fox hunting legislation. Be a tad daft to allow England and Wales to relax such controls, just when you're trying to tighten them up yourself.
The Scottish Government want stronger anti fox hunting legislation. Be a tad daft to allow England and Wales to relax such controls, just when you're trying to tighten them up yourself.
Isn't it strange though that since 2007 there's been no move to do so? So after 8 years in Government and doing nothing about Fox Hunting they suddenly say they are considering tightening the law.
Isn't it strange though that since 2007 there's been no move to do so? So after 8 years in Government and doing nothing about Fox Hunting they suddenly say they are considering tightening the law.
Isn't it strange though that since 2007 there's been no move to do so? So after 8 years in Government and doing nothing about Fox Hunting they suddenly say they are considering tightening the law.
Aye right;-)
I expect there are a reasonable amount of votes at stake and didn't want to jeopardise them. Principles only go so far.
I expect there are a reasonable amount of votes at stake and didn't want to jeopardise them. Principles only go so far.
The thing is, sensibly, that the only people who would object to this action, whatever the reasons for it, are those who have a beef with the SNP. Hell, even Sky News, that bastion of Tory support, is barely making any noise about it. Any decent person would object to any thought of opening up fox hunting, whatever their political persuasions.
As regards SNP votes, good to see the Daily Mail reporting today that the SNP are heading for a landslide next year
I don't mind if the SNP vote on non Scottish matters but it just seems strange to me that they would vote to deny England parity with Scotland on Fox Hunting.
If anything I would have thought they would vote for the amendment. It seems a very strange thing to do and simply comes across as deliberately voting on an issue that won't affect Scotland just to agitate.
However, it does fall within the narrative of creating discourse between Scotland and England leading to Scottish independence and so I can see the tactics here.
I would think that the main reasoning here is that the Scottish hunting laws need tightening up , to the same level as in England. Which I believe is what the Scottish government is looking at. Any dilution of the E & W law would make that more difficult to implement.
I don't mind if the SNP vote on non Scottish matters but it just seems strange to me that they would vote to deny England parity with Scotland on Fox Hunting.
If anything I would have thought they would vote for the amendment. It seems a very strange thing to do and simply comes across as deliberately voting on an issue that won't affect Scotland just to agitate.
However, it does fall within the narrative of creating discourse between Scotland and England leading to Scottish independence and so I can see the tactics here.
You are wrong as you know full well that the Tory proposals go much further than the current Scottish laws but hey being inaccurate about the SNP is your specialist subject
I would think that the main reasoning here is that the Scottish hunting laws need tightening up , to the same level as in England. Which I believe is what the Scottish government is looking at. Any dilution of the E & W law would make that more difficult to implement.
So they have had since 2007 to 'tighten' up the law and havent until they get a chance to simply vote on nothing to do with Scotland?
I would think that the main reasoning here is that the Scottish hunting laws need tightening up , to the same level as in England. Which I believe is what the Scottish government is looking at. Any dilution of the E & W law would make that more difficult to implement.
Seems strange that a policy so important that they abandon their principles didn't even make it into their own manifesto.
Rumours now that the vote will be pulled tomorrow until EVEL is in place.
Yet I thought the EVEL proposal was an English veto as opposed to an English railroad. So in this scenario, even a majority of English MPs voting in favour can't change the Hunting Act because it would also require a majority of all MPs (who vote).
I would think that the main reasoning here is that the Scottish hunting laws need tightening up , to the same level as in England. Which I believe is what the Scottish government is looking at. Any dilution of the E & W law would make that more difficult to implement.
That's a cover story. The whole point according to Sturgeon is to send a political message to the government about the narrowness of its majority. The sooner the better with regard to preventing Scottish MPs voting on such legislation.
I expect there are a reasonable amount of votes at stake and didn't want to jeopardise them. Principles only go so far.
It seems that they have already lost the vote of some SNP supporters here by doing it. Ashbourne certainly indicated they would lose her vote if it happened.
Abandoning their principles simply to prove a political point is the reality here.
Comments
Not sure why Labour are still so against, it's not like they have many seats left in Scotland anymore.
The only hypocrisy is coming from the Tories who are trying to deceitfully reintroduce full fox hunting by the back door. Furthermore, nationwide British animal welfare charities have lobbied MPs over this issue and that includes all the SNP MPs too. The SNP MPs are therefore responding in a principled way to stop the back door reintroduction of a savage and barbarian activity:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKhG33KMWM8
^^^ That is exactly what the Tally Ho! Eton Tory toffs want back and now they are much less likely to succeed.
A Daily Mail link to oppose a proposal to align with Scottish Law on fox hunting.
Could this get any more ridiculous?
Get your facts right - the SNP is actually considering tightening up the legislation that applies in Scotland.
Well I hope you are right. I hope that this is voted down on Wednesday but it's a bit rich if the SNP vote against it and leave the law the same in Scotland. I wouldn't trust them as far as I could throw them though.
"“We are in a situation where the Tory government are refusing to agree to any amendments to improve the Scotland bill – which are supported by 58 of Scotland’s 59 MPs – and imposing English votes for English laws to make Scotland’s representation at Westminster second class,” he said.
“In these circumstances, it is right and proper that we assert the Scottish interest on foxhunting by voting with Labour against the Tories’ proposals to relax the ban – in the process, reminding an arrogant UK government of just how slender their majority is – just as we will vote against the Tory welfare cuts next week and appeal to Labour to join us.”"
This is what the toff Tory lovers of fox hunting want to bring back on Wednesday:
"Clifford, of Newport, South Wales, told of one truly horrendous moment when hounds pulled a pregnant fox from her den and ripped it apart. Afterwards, the hunt master put the heel of his boot on the three squirming pups that had been inside her and crushed them."
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/former-fox-hunter-exposes-full-6054986
Well Im a tory voter and not a toff by any manner of means but I certainly wouldnt be backing them on this one. I think my local Tory MP is voting against it and I hope that alot of other Tory MPs do the same.
How many times are you going to use the Tory toff ad hominem on these fox threads?
I don't mind if the SNP vote on non Scottish matters but it just seems strange to me that they would vote to deny England parity with Scotland on Fox Hunting.
If anything I would have thought they would vote for the amendment. It seems a very strange thing to do and simply comes across as deliberately voting on an issue that won't affect Scotland just to agitate.
However, it does fall within the narrative of creating discourse between Scotland and England leading to Scottish independence and so I can see the tactics here.
The point is, we do the same and so shouldn't we sort our own garden out before interfering in our neighbours?
Exactly!!!
The Scottish Government want stronger anti fox hunting legislation. Be a tad daft to allow England and Wales to relax such controls, just when you're trying to tighten them up yourself.
Nae point in sorting out your own garden, if your neighbour is letting his go to seed.
Isn't it strange though that since 2007 there's been no move to do so? So after 8 years in Government and doing nothing about Fox Hunting they suddenly say they are considering tightening the law.
Aye right;-)
You mess with the bull - you get the horns.
I expect there are a reasonable amount of votes at stake and didn't want to jeopardise them. Principles only go so far.
The thing is, sensibly, that the only people who would object to this action, whatever the reasons for it, are those who have a beef with the SNP. Hell, even Sky News, that bastion of Tory support, is barely making any noise about it. Any decent person would object to any thought of opening up fox hunting, whatever their political persuasions.
As regards SNP votes, good to see the Daily Mail reporting today that the SNP are heading for a landslide next year
I would think that the main reasoning here is that the Scottish hunting laws need tightening up , to the same level as in England. Which I believe is what the Scottish government is looking at. Any dilution of the E & W law would make that more difficult to implement.
You are wrong as you know full well that the Tory proposals go much further than the current Scottish laws but hey being inaccurate about the SNP is your specialist subject
So they have had since 2007 to 'tighten' up the law and havent until they get a chance to simply vote on nothing to do with Scotland?
Thats sound reasoning.
Seems strange that a policy so important that they abandon their principles didn't even make it into their own manifesto.
Yet I thought the EVEL proposal was an English veto as opposed to an English railroad. So in this scenario, even a majority of English MPs voting in favour can't change the Hunting Act because it would also require a majority of all MPs (who vote).
That's a cover story. The whole point according to Sturgeon is to send a political message to the government about the narrowness of its majority. The sooner the better with regard to preventing Scottish MPs voting on such legislation.
It seems that they have already lost the vote of some SNP supporters here by doing it. Ashbourne certainly indicated they would lose her vote if it happened.
Abandoning their principles simply to prove a political point is the reality here.